I don't know much about the ideology other than it allegedly fuses Arab Nationalism with Socialism and is divided between a Syrian and an Iraqi interpretation.
Beyond that I've heard a lot of claims about it ranging from accusations of it basically being Arab Fascism to being a genuinely non-Marxist Socialist project to being simply an anti-colonial bourgeois revolutionary movement.
English sources that aren't inherently biased against it (thanks Langley) are rare so I'm looking for an actually informed take on Ba'athism both as a theory and as a practice. Was it good? Was it bad? Was it good but flawed? Was it bad but had some genuine upsides? Was it good in context but bad generally (e.g. deserves critical support)?
What's the deal, exactly?
deathtoreddit - 2mon
If you want a good primer to Ba'athism - this video helped me (CW: channel is patsoc vibes, despite renouncing Caleb Maupin, so take it with a grain of salt)
beyond that I’ve heard a lot of claims about it ranging from accusations of it basically being Arab Fascism
Oh that reminds me
as you would know, pan-Arab nationalism is surprisingly but understandably pro-secular, meaning due to lack of religious influence on the Arab state, anyone who is Shia or Sunni Muslim, Christian, or any derivative could socially mobilize, unlike a pan-Islamic movement.
The thing I find wrong with once-existing Ba'athism is it inexplicably leads to minority rule (Alawite-dominated party over Sunni majority Syria or Sunni-dominated party over Shia majority Iraq)
This proved to be the contradiction that undermined these states, besides, ofc, the external factor of U.S imperialism helping cause the destruction of these states through its relentless sanctions and war against them.
15
TankieReplyBot - 2mon
I found a YouTube link in your comment. Here are links to the same video on alternative frontends that protect your privacy:
Eh, it sorta does but it's a bit confusing to an outside observer because obviously enough Iraqi ba'athism is probably more closely related to fascism of National socialism then it is actual socialism, while typically the Ba'athism practiced in Syria was more closely aligned to actual socialism, well for a time at least (Bashar Al Assad eventually decided to drink the lib juice and effectively torpedoed the Syrian economy with liberal economic reforms, and hence kicked off the Syrian civil war so, fun.)
Either way the more accurate statement would be to say is that ba'athism is ultimately a Arab nationalist ideology that has two, almost entirely distinct branches.
Right-wing Ba'athism, the sort of Ba'athism practiced in Iraq before the Americans decided to invade and then effectively turn the country into an Iranian puppet state.
Left-wing Ba'athism, practiced in Syria which then eventually got dumptered by liberal infiltration (Bashar Al Assad) and then hit the shits at mark 8 velocity.
Either way Ba'athism is for all intense and purposes a dead ideology, that failed due to the inherent contradictions of all regimes (even socialist ones) built without a class base, this is the same reason why Nassarism failed as well, btw, so yeah, tl'dr, even your trying to make a socialist state then your first priority should be to root your politics on that of a class line, something that Nassarism, Left wing Ba'athism, and quite a few others failed to do (though Nassarism could in my opinion but still, and maybe left wing Ba'athism, maybe.)
11
principalkohoutek [none/use name] - 2mon
Was Kadaffi a baathist?
4
deathtoreddit - 2mon
Qaddafism is an Arab-African nationalist ideology of his own.
From my very ignorant understanding, Ba'athism is essentially Nationalist Socialism with Arab characteristics in a semi-colonial/anti-colonial situation.
pyromaiden in asklemmygrad
What's the deal with Ba'athism?
I don't know much about the ideology other than it allegedly fuses Arab Nationalism with Socialism and is divided between a Syrian and an Iraqi interpretation.
Beyond that I've heard a lot of claims about it ranging from accusations of it basically being Arab Fascism to being a genuinely non-Marxist Socialist project to being simply an anti-colonial bourgeois revolutionary movement.
English sources that aren't inherently biased against it (thanks Langley) are rare so I'm looking for an actually informed take on Ba'athism both as a theory and as a practice. Was it good? Was it bad? Was it good but flawed? Was it bad but had some genuine upsides? Was it good in context but bad generally (e.g. deserves critical support)?
What's the deal, exactly?
If you want a good primer to Ba'athism - this video helped me (CW: channel is patsoc vibes, despite renouncing Caleb Maupin, so take it with a grain of salt)
Oh that reminds me
as you would know, pan-Arab nationalism is surprisingly but understandably pro-secular, meaning due to lack of religious influence on the Arab state, anyone who is Shia or Sunni Muslim, Christian, or any derivative could socially mobilize, unlike a pan-Islamic movement.
The thing I find wrong with once-existing Ba'athism is it inexplicably leads to minority rule (Alawite-dominated party over Sunni majority Syria or Sunni-dominated party over Shia majority Iraq)
This proved to be the contradiction that undermined these states, besides, ofc, the external factor of U.S imperialism helping cause the destruction of these states through its relentless sanctions and war against them.
I found a YouTube link in your comment. Here are links to the same video on alternative frontends that protect your privacy:
Eh, it sorta does but it's a bit confusing to an outside observer because obviously enough Iraqi ba'athism is probably more closely related to fascism of National socialism then it is actual socialism, while typically the Ba'athism practiced in Syria was more closely aligned to actual socialism, well for a time at least (Bashar Al Assad eventually decided to drink the lib juice and effectively torpedoed the Syrian economy with liberal economic reforms, and hence kicked off the Syrian civil war so, fun.)
Either way the more accurate statement would be to say is that ba'athism is ultimately a Arab nationalist ideology that has two, almost entirely distinct branches.
Right-wing Ba'athism, the sort of Ba'athism practiced in Iraq before the Americans decided to invade and then effectively turn the country into an Iranian puppet state.
Left-wing Ba'athism, practiced in Syria which then eventually got dumptered by liberal infiltration (Bashar Al Assad) and then hit the shits at mark 8 velocity.
Either way Ba'athism is for all intense and purposes a dead ideology, that failed due to the inherent contradictions of all regimes (even socialist ones) built without a class base, this is the same reason why Nassarism failed as well, btw, so yeah, tl'dr, even your trying to make a socialist state then your first priority should be to root your politics on that of a class line, something that Nassarism, Left wing Ba'athism, and quite a few others failed to do (though Nassarism could in my opinion but still, and maybe left wing Ba'athism, maybe.)
Was Kadaffi a baathist?
Qaddafism is an Arab-African nationalist ideology of his own.
😭
If you are interested on this topic in depth, I recommend this lecture: Ba'athism: Ideology, History, Revolution.
I find that lecture very helpful to understand Ba'athism.
I found a YouTube link in your comment. Here are links to the same video on alternative frontends that protect your privacy:
From my very ignorant understanding, Ba'athism is essentially Nationalist Socialism with Arab characteristics in a semi-colonial/anti-colonial situation.