i support market socialism (with welfare and a land value tax) under a party-union-state government (in which parties and unions both work in government, but the state is entirely separate and is downsized to enforcing and administrating, as per minarchism).
i also support multiple political parties (led by a vanguard socialist party), as well as democracy (democratic dictatorship of the proletariat)
i also support minarchism because obviously the people would have to do more of the work than the state. get the government outta here!
what ideology do i support as a result?
Erika3sis [she/her, xe/xem] - 1mon
Do you feel a need to label your ideology, and if so, why do you think you feel that need? I haven't really labeled my own ideology in years because I don't think there's much of a point to it, if anything using hard labels can make a person's beliefs inflexible.
10
DylanMc6 [any, any] - 1mon
what i'm trying to say is that i support left-libertarianism. seriously!
1
Erika3sis [she/her, xe/xem] - 1mon
So you had already come to a conclusion, and just wanted people to guess what you'd already concluded?
7
knifestealingcrow [any] - 1mon
I think trying to figure out exactly what kind of ideology you support based on how you believe things should be is somewhat an inevitable part of being a new socialist (I did it too) but it's also asking the wrong questions. It's just mapping your ideas and imposing them on the world, when what you should be asking yourself is how did society evolve to get to this point and how do we move forward from the way things are.
Those sorts of questions, when combined with looking at the way things have played out in history, tend to lead you to only a handful of conclusions. You don't really need to focus on ideology itself, since that will inevitably change as you learn and grow. Ultimately, the label you choose isn't important.
Good luck!
8
DylanMc6 [any, any] - 1mon
what i'm trying to say is that i support left-libertarianism. seriously!
1
knifestealingcrow [any] - 1mon
I get that! I'm just trying to gently encourage you to start thinking a little more about how your beliefs work rather than what they're classified as. Ask yourself questions like:
How does this "party-union-state" work?
Who represents who? Do the unions represent all unionized workers and the parties represent all non-unionized workers? If this is the case, why not have all workers be unionized? If not, who makes up the parties?
How are the state and government separate from each other? How are decisions made (by majority, plurality, consensus, etc) and carried out? If the state is separate from the unions and the parties, then who makes up the state? How is that decided?
How do we get to this system from the one we have now? Do we participate in elections and change it from the inside? Do we get enough of the population unionized and threaten a general strike? Have people tried to create this system in the past? If yes, how has it worked out for them? In what ways did they succeed, and in what ways did they fail? What lessons can we learn from those successes and failures?
I'm not asking these questions because I want you to answer them all right now (though if you want to answer them feel welcome!) but rather to get you thinking about them. In case it isn't clear, I mean this in good faith! It makes me happy to see someone identifying problems with the current system and creatively trying to sort out ways to change it. I just think the effort spent in trying to label those beliefs is better spent on trying to make them a reality.
6
DylanMc6 [any, any] - 1mon
parties and unions help economically and politically (like in de leonism), but the state is entirely separate from the parties and the unions and is downsized to enforcing and administrating. basically, the state is NOT the most important part, that would be the parties and unions.
the political parties are represented by workers, farmers and activists. as for the unions, all workers would be probably unified in a union federation which works with the parties.
minarchism involves a smaller government (and in turn a smaller state) that's for enforcing and administrating. the people do more of the work than the state. also, as per indigenous confederations, stateless nations and decentralized socialist assembles and such, a government can work without a state.
either elections or revolution, but with what's happening in the us (the ice raids and all), i think a revolution is the way to go. seriously!
1
deforestgump [he/him, comrade/them] - 1mon
GOP
4
Erika3sis [she/her, xe/xem] - 1mon
Please keep in mind that OP is autistic
5
DylanMc6 [any, any] - 1mon
libertarian socialism (socialism with minarchism) is NOT the same as conservative libertarianism. seriously!
1
deforestgump [he/him, comrade/them] - 1mon
my apologies. i was only kidding. my response wasn't even a reaction to anything you described. just bad taste.
3
DylanMc6 [any, any] - 1mon
you're fine, i forgive you. that said, how would you describe my socialist views?
1
deforestgump [he/him, comrade/them] - 1mon
I agree with folks on here that you shouldn’t have to concern yourself with labels. As paternal as this might sound: just live life and have fun! The more you read and discover the world, you will find bits and pieces from theory you can apply to your current circumstances. The idea of being on the left is and always should be, continual revolution.
1
gayspacemarxist [comrade/them, she/her] - 1mon
What's the benefit of an extra small state? What mechanism would keep it that way?
1
DylanMc6 [any, any] - 1mon
i think that there can be a government without a state (or with an unimportant downsized state), as per indigenous confederations, stateless nations and even libertarian socialist assemblies. the government should be separate from a coercive state - the government can still handle the political work, but a state can just handle enforcing and administering. seriously!
1
DylanMc6 [any, any] - 1mon
i think that the state should be downsized before it even withers away. seriously!
1
gayspacemarxist [comrade/them, she/her] - 1mon
That doesn't really answer the question tho, does it?
DylanMc6 in main
question about my socialist views
what ideology do i support as a result?
Do you feel a need to label your ideology, and if so, why do you think you feel that need? I haven't really labeled my own ideology in years because I don't think there's much of a point to it, if anything using hard labels can make a person's beliefs inflexible.
what i'm trying to say is that i support left-libertarianism. seriously!
So you had already come to a conclusion, and just wanted people to guess what you'd already concluded?
I think trying to figure out exactly what kind of ideology you support based on how you believe things should be is somewhat an inevitable part of being a new socialist (I did it too) but it's also asking the wrong questions. It's just mapping your ideas and imposing them on the world, when what you should be asking yourself is how did society evolve to get to this point and how do we move forward from the way things are.
Those sorts of questions, when combined with looking at the way things have played out in history, tend to lead you to only a handful of conclusions. You don't really need to focus on ideology itself, since that will inevitably change as you learn and grow. Ultimately, the label you choose isn't important.
Good luck!
what i'm trying to say is that i support left-libertarianism. seriously!
I get that! I'm just trying to gently encourage you to start thinking a little more about how your beliefs work rather than what they're classified as. Ask yourself questions like:
I'm not asking these questions because I want you to answer them all right now (though if you want to answer them feel welcome!) but rather to get you thinking about them. In case it isn't clear, I mean this in good faith! It makes me happy to see someone identifying problems with the current system and creatively trying to sort out ways to change it. I just think the effort spent in trying to label those beliefs is better spent on trying to make them a reality.
GOP
Please keep in mind that OP is autistic
libertarian socialism (socialism with minarchism) is NOT the same as conservative libertarianism. seriously!
my apologies. i was only kidding. my response wasn't even a reaction to anything you described. just bad taste.
you're fine, i forgive you. that said, how would you describe my socialist views?
I agree with folks on here that you shouldn’t have to concern yourself with labels. As paternal as this might sound: just live life and have fun! The more you read and discover the world, you will find bits and pieces from theory you can apply to your current circumstances. The idea of being on the left is and always should be, continual revolution.
What's the benefit of an extra small state? What mechanism would keep it that way?
i think that there can be a government without a state (or with an unimportant downsized state), as per indigenous confederations, stateless nations and even libertarian socialist assemblies. the government should be separate from a coercive state - the government can still handle the political work, but a state can just handle enforcing and administering. seriously!
i think that the state should be downsized before it even withers away. seriously!
That doesn't really answer the question tho, does it?
what's the question again?
https://hexbear.net/comment/6669711