I hope everyone had a great week! Hang out. Chat. Talk about what's going on. Have fun :3
SnowySkyes - 2.3yr
Posting from my hospital room this week. Hope everyone is doing well.
::: spoiler CW: Talking about bottom surgery and some other icky things
This week has been such a fantastic one for me. I got my bottom surgery done last Friday and I’m still in the hospital recovering from it. It has done an astronomical amount of good for me already and I still haven’t seen it. I am calmer. I feel as through the weight of the world has been lifted off my shoulders. I feel at peace for the first time in…ever I think. Like, I have been able to just sit here and pass out for no reason whatsoever. For most that sounds whatever, but I have never been able to do that. I’m smiling huge and wide and nothing can bring this girl down. I feel AMAZING!!!
That said, there have been things I wasn’t expecting. Like for one, it feels like my scrotum has been scrunched, stretched out, and lain over a canvas. My dickhead feels like it’s being crushed and in 3 different places. And at times, if eels like my entire old package was collapsed into a singularity. It’s so weird. I just need to remind myself that they don’t exist anymore. :)
Gods. What a fucking week.
:::
33
kristina [she/her] - 2.3yr
hopefully it doesnt hurt too much. DRUGS
20
RedQuestionAsker2 [he/him, she/her] - 2.3yr
-explaining to a gamer-
Okay, you know how sometimes you start a game, and you have to pick a build, but nobody really tells you anything about it, so you just pick the one that is recommended and looks easy? But after some time, you realize that you aren't having fun with that build, but people around are used to you playing that build? You want to respec, but respeccing costs money, and once you respec, there's gonna be a long period of you being really bad at playing your new build?.
It's like that.
25
RedQuestionAsker2 [he/him, she/her] - 2.3yr
Been trying voice training, and I showed my wife my femme voice, and she, very supportively said, "it sounds really good. You sound like contrapoints :)))"
🤮 🤮 🤮
23
kristina [she/her] - 2.3yr
segue into becoming a valley girl just to not sound like contra
19
die_livster @lemmygrad.ml - 2.3yr
a finger on the monkeys paw closes
you now sound like blaire white
17
RedQuestionAsker2 [he/him, she/her] - 2.3yr
I, like, totally, couldn't handle that!
15
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
Gay for boys, straight for girls
man why does this suck what gives
Gay Straight for boys, straight gay for girls
oh wait this is much better now
23
machiabelly [she/her] - 2.3yr
Gay for girls! I never understood why I couldn't get things with women to feel right before!
16
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
yeah, like, "why can't i find a gf???" it's because you keep trying to date straight girls lol
8
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
I adore how much your own gender impacts your attraction, when you alter your own self it makes a huge difference to how you relate to & kiss other people. I fuckin love being a lesbian.
8
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
yeah, I remember having the
HIGHLY CISGENDER THOUGHT
of being lowkey jealous of lesbians because deep down i knew sexual/romantic attraction hit different depending on where it came from and that as a cis guy i would just never be able to experience that
6
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
Cis men really are missing out. They should transition so they can be women-loving-women as well.
6
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
Having a voice that doesn't pass
Voice training
just become nonverbal lol
21
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
My phase where I decided I was just gonna write on a notepad instead of speaking, before I quit giving a fuck
18
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
punching shit into my spell and speak
"EFF! YOU! CEE! KAY! TEE! EEE! ARE! EFF! ESS!"
16
kristina [she/her] - 2.3yr
i feel like the easiest way to pass is to simply have long hair
20
RedQuestionAsker2 [he/him, she/her] - 2.3yr
I got bullied out of having long hair in high school.
But nobody can stop me now.
16
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
Can confirm, which kinda sucks because having cool.short dykey hair should not preclude you being gendered correctly. But people assume, no goofyass MAN would keep such an incredible wavy butt-length waterfall in such amazing condition ✨
10
kristina [she/her] - 2.3yr
It's pretty funny. All these transphobe are like "I can always tell" and then as soon as you grow your hair out 6 inches doing nothing else, they act like you're Snake under a cardboard box
9
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
Forced feminisation, but instead of just being a kink you are on a mission to awaken all transfemmes to their identities :)
19
RedQuestionAsker2 [he/him, she/her] - 2.3yr
DBZ scouter but it shows egg levels.
Extended They Live fight scene where the eggs refuse to put the scouter on
14
JohannaChittarra - 2.3yr
down with cis
19
SnowySkyes - 2.3yr
Still recovering. Will be going home later today, but I still have trapped gas in my shoulders causing me severe pain when I need to move. Also developed some nausea over the past 24 hours. Feeling generally unwell. Not sure if normal or something I should alert someone about.
19
Edie [it/its] - 2.3yr
Since you're not sure, try to talk with someone, rather talk too much than too little.
11
SnowySkyes - 2.3yr
I managed to earlier. Apparently it’s fairly common for a while post-op, so I’m going to continue as normal for the time being.
6
yoink [she/her] - 2.3yr
can confirm, it shouldnt go on for too long but yeah your body is recovering - used to have to take anti-nausea tablets for a few weeks after
also happy to answer any other questions around being post-op if you did have any! i'm about 5 years post also congrats, glad things went well by the sounds of it !!
6
Edie [it/its] - 2.3yr
Great.
6
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
Damn that last mega really was poppin' off, love to see it ❤
18
RedQuestionAsker2 [he/him, she/her] - 2.3yr
The gang's all here
13
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
oh hey, more shit that's gender envy now :)
12
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
11
kristina [she/her] - 2.3yr
gotta get those numbers up
9
khizuo [ze/zir] - 2.3yr
I’ve made so many stenciled cloth patches recently and here are some I thought the mega might enjoy
18
lapis [fae/faer, comrade/them] - 2.3yr
do you have a source for the art for that hammer + sickle + gender symbols? that thing is fuckin' incredible.
12
khizuo [ze/zir] - 2.3yr
the original source seems to be this
on a side note, i realized after i had sent the images that the bottom photo accidentally got flipped sideways, lol
9
lapis [fae/faer, comrade/them] - 2.3yr
this is so cool, thanks for sharing!
5
JohannaChittarra - 2.3yr
These are so good!
8
CDommunist [she/her, love/loves] - 2.3yr
Hexbear is alive
17
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
about a week before i was able to come out to myself as trans my dear trans femme friend sent me this poem to look over. i remember being moved by the second paragraph, but i couldn't make any sense of the third
it all really is too clear now
17
RedQuestionAsker2 [he/him, she/her] - 2.3yr
That last paragraph reminds me when my anxiety had me at my lowest. Literally curled crying on the ground daily. Felt like I completely lost myself and had to reconstruct myself. I was clinging on for dear life. Literally every moment of holding on was a victory. Like the passage, I actually imagined having ropes to hold my mind together.
So glad that's behind me now. Despite the pain I feel now, it pales in comparison to that. Feels like I can face anything now.
Beautiful writing.
10
grym - 2.3yr
Beautiful. I really want to share this to some friends.
9
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
Did your dear transfemme friend write this? Good shit.
8
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
no, and i don't know who did, but i cab always ask
6
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
Oke, ty, just curious cause it's superb
6
Florn [they/them] - 2.3yr
"Balloon on a string" is actually imagery I've thought of before myself
4
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
for me it was more like a 100lb weight i strapped to my chest. this burden i just had to bear. I felt light and free when I finally was able to tell myself that I could take it off
5
BountifulEggnog [it/its, she/her] - 2.3yr
Why is my dislike of being a guy getting stronger
This was not supposed to happen
17
RedQuestionAsker2 [he/him, she/her] - 2.3yr
You're being affected by hexbear trans radiation
12
BountifulEggnog [it/its, she/her] - 2.3yr
This is my personal Chernobyl.
10
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
trying to figure out your trans when you're bisexual is really weird and hard. like, both are great? i don't want to look like a man, but at the same time, men are really fucking hot??? what gives?
16
Jenniferrr [she/her, comrade/them] - 2.3yr
Yes. Also - is it gender envy or sexual attraction: the game.
But yes being bi and trans is very confusing also idk if it's like this for you but like my attraction to men is completely different than my attraction to women. So like how will I choose -.-
11
Babs [she/her] - 2.3yr
The bi-cycle can be a real motherfucker, especially when your tastes are so varied.
7
Jenniferrr [she/her, comrade/them] - 2.3yr
Yeah I simultaneously want to be a lwsbian muscle mommy and be made to feel small and fragile by a man. I feel like I exist like in the middle lol
8
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
is it gender envy or sexual attraction: the game.
actually the only consistent answer i ever get to this question is "both" and honestly i think that's a great answer
7
Jenniferrr [she/her, comrade/them] - 2.3yr
So true it pretty much is mostly both haha. I was watching this totally trash TV show last night called love island, which is basically hot straight people being hot and straight and I think I mostly get envy from the women on there, cause for the most part straight girls aren't that attractive to me (I want their legs though).
Side note: they should make a dating game show like that with all bi people. That would be entertaining af
6
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
Genderfluid partner who can do both?
7
Lenins_Cat_Reincarnated - 2.3yr
YES
10
milistanaccount09 [she/her] - 2.3yr
reminder: being a trans woman is cool and awesome
16
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
oh my it is good and back to be posting. I don't know if I should post the exact date but like
appointment with Planned Parenthood? Booked at about 2.5 months out!!!
16
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
Did you tell them it was gonna be a hot girl summer?
10
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
no, it's actually been unusually cold about here and i we were complaining about that instead
8
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
Cold girl spring =)
6
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
i always loved winter fashions more anyway :)
7
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
Warm cozy cardigans, scarves, incredible winter coats, thigh-high boots. Winter mom fashion is my vibe yes
7
kristina [she/her] - 2.3yr
based
10
BountifulEggnog [it/its, she/her] - 2.3yr
I hope this isn't prying, but what is your appointment for? I was under the impression planned parenthood essentially just did birth control, nothing trans issue related.
6
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
Informed consent for HRT? at least they do that here in Placeofresidencysburg
6
BountifulEggnog [it/its, she/her] - 2.3yr
Oh that's cool! I had forgotten. Hope its a quick couple of months for you!
5
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler Being crass about orchi
Okay so I kind of wanna get my fuckin balls chopped off, so I can tuck easier and so I don't ever need to worry about the encroaching menace of testosterone. But I'm pretty worried it'd interfere with potential future stuff if/when I wanted bottom surgery...
:::
16
kristina [she/her] - 2.3yr
mood
9
Babs [she/her] - 2.3yr
I too wish to strike a killing blow against the testosterone demon. But yeah, same worries.
7
SorosFootSoldier [he/him, they/them] - 2.3yr
Happy 4/20! oops I mean Eclipse Day
16
DerEwigeAtheist [she/her, comrade/them] - 2.3yr
I think I have been very dysphoric lately, and it's possibly because I have done very few gender affirming things. I just am too nervous to be perceived.
15
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
You know, it's funny. I find my gender dysphoria can actually get really bad if I do too many gender affirming things and then suddenly have to switch back to do something like boymode at work
I'm really sorry you're feeling like that though :(
10
DerEwigeAtheist [she/her, comrade/them] - 2.3yr
I now hav an appointment with an hrt person, at a place recommended to me by the local trans community. Hope it will go well.
Connecting with the locals is really important, does not solve everything, but for example I, without them, would have needed several more months till I tried again at a doctors apoointment.
15
BountifulEggnog [it/its, she/her] - 2.3yr
The masculine urge to shave my entire body
15
KittyBobo [he/him, comrade/them] - 2.3yr
There's actually no such thing as being cisgender. Everyone is already trans, and all trans people know it, it's just considered rude to point that fact out since peopleneed to figure that out on their own with only gentle guidance. We're all eggs and Hexbear is on a mission to make the world's biggest omelet.
15
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
To be real with some of the replies in the mega plus how many people come in here weekly, I kind of think this halfway unironically
12
Outdoor_Catgirl [she/her, they/them] - 2.3yr
Unfortunately, this is selection bias. People who are cool tend to be more trans than people who suck.
8
JohannaChittarra - 2.3yr
9
Jenniferrr [she/her, comrade/them] - 2.3yr
Adventure time giving me so much gender envy lol
15
Tommasi [she/her, pup/pup's] - 2.3yr
Major breast pain the last few days, hoping it's a sign of growth happening.
Just a few weeks into HRT my aerolas got really puffy, and went from being mostly flat to small mounds, but almost nothing else has happened except directly around them yet, and it makes me feel insecure about wearing tighter shirts and stuff.
15
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
You will need bras or very very loose and thick shirts soon :) or pasties I guess, lol
10
Tommasi [she/her, pup/pup's] - 2.3yr
I actually asked about this in a previous mega, and people gave me some good options for what I should look at. So far it's been cold enough for multiple layers, but soon there's gonna be t-shirt weather and I don't want to walk around with nipples basically poking through the fabric.
3
rtstragedy - 2.3yr
in case you dont know, they should continue to grow for several years as long as your levels are good, even if the pain and tenderness does subside after a while
6
die_livster @lemmygrad.ml - 2.3yr
just some rambling (cw racism)
moved from rural yorkshire to montreal last year
been thinking a lot about yorkshire, i miss it a lot - being surrounded by hills in valleys for 20ish shaped me a lot i think..
for the first few years of my life i essentially lived in a slum in bradford; from as early i can remember my mum told me about how nice bradford was during her childhood and blamed polish and pakistani people for ruining it. of course, she was describing white flight and the intentional destruction of bradford by the state wielding the automobile.
blah blah p*kis caused this
that's racist
i would say
(mockingly) that's racist
she would reply to 7 or 8 year old me. what 0 materialism does to a mf!
a couple of years ago i moved to a town in the happy valley with a trans girl from northern ireland i met on 4chan, we'd only met irl once before moving in together (purely platonic). she was a complete lib and i only realised how rude and cruel she'd been to me after i moved out. we were both desperate to get away from our parents. she'd make constant comments about my weight (not that it matters, but I had a normal BMI!) and call me a 0 effort passoid. eventually i cut her off after a fucking episode of the rehearsal of all things. we still lived together for a few weeks and during that time she ruined some of my medication that i had to keep in the fridge. it was the zionist episode and she had some interesting opinions on jews. she justified those opinions to me after i challenged her on them, "everyone on twitter says...."
i feel an overwhelming sense of powerlessness when i think of yorkshire. god's own country, truly. the conditions some people live in there are horrible. as soon as i moved to quebec i could only think how people would react if they knew how high north american living standards are. i miss the market towns (despite being full of pensioners), i miss the cities (despite being full of londoners), i miss the stunning landscape (despite it being continually ravaged). the roman empire was once ruled from york and now it's a glorified tourist attraction. i feel like i lost something i never had
https://lemmygrad.ml/pictrs/image/64c818c6-1c2f-4cb9-8b8f-f9fdf90f1f0a.jpeg
15
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
with a trans girl from northern ireland i met on 4chan, we'd only met irl once before moving in together (purely platonic). she was a complete lib
I was gonna say "you were lucky 'lib' is as bad as she was given it's 4ch", and then I saw the word "passoid". /tttt/ is a death cult I think. Wtf kind of an insult is "0 effort passoid" anyway???
15
die_livster @lemmygrad.ml - 2.3yr
i think the emphasis was on 0 effort because at the time i pretty much exclusively wore grey tracksuits. i figured yk she's from ireland she's said some kinda leftie things she's probably chill we're both desperate to move
Hello everyone, how are you all!!! Hopefully good!!! Anyways have a great week, much love 🥰🥰🥰🏳️⚧️🏳️⚧️🏳️⚧️🥰🥰🥰
14
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
i keep looking in the mirror and thinking how much i don't look like a girl, but i always immediately follow that thought up with "yeah and imagine how funny it's going to be in the before and after pics when you're the cutest girl in this hemisphere" and immediately start giggling to myself
14
kristina [she/her] - 2.3yr
nothing gives me a bigger sense of superiority than having bigger boobs than my cis friends
18
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
honestly the only reason I don't "want" tits is that if they come in faster than i'm ready to come out then I'm kind of screwed, but like, oh my, yes please
11
thirtymilliondeadfish [she/her] - 2.3yr
join your local ibtc chapter
4
RedQuestionAsker2 [he/him, she/her] - 2.3yr
Gotta mogg the cissies
8
khizuo [ze/zir] - 2.3yr
My friend who recently got on testosterone told me yesterday that their mood has like, substantially improved since starting T and that they’ve started liking themselves more in just a few weeks… damn this HRT shit really is magic, huh. I can’t wait to try it out for myself.
14
Edie [it/its] - 2.3yr
Me 4(+) years ago: I want to be more feminine. I want to be "mistaken" for a girl.
[Does fuck all, except having these thoughts for years]
Me now: I'm trans.
Wow, well done Edward for finally internalising this. Too bad the younger you would write about this in your notebook and then throw it out, not like we would ever want it later would we?
Now what Edward? Time for change, or do we just continue with the same policy.
14
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
Now what Edward?
WHICH WAY, TRANSGENDER WOMAN?
11
Edie [it/its] - 2.3yr
I have to come out?
Nope. Business as usual is much better.
8
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
I mean you don't, that's a choice you can make for yourself whenever you like. You can always mess around without doing anything so earth-shaking. Try epilating, paint your nails, maybe a bit of feminising hormone therapy on the side, y'know?
11
Edie [it/its] - 2.3yr
Try epilating
I have actually shaved before. And worn thigh-highs, and skirts.
paint your nails
Good idea.
maybe a bit of feminising hormone therapy on the side, y’know?
No I don't.
6
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
Alright well y'know, point is you can play with your presentation and self as much or as little as you want, however much you are comfortable with
7
RedQuestionAsker2 [he/him, she/her] - 2.3yr
Feeling really good today largely from all the support I've gotten here lately.
Thank you everyone
14
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler cw: transphobia but it's funny joke
uhm actually when archeologists dig up your skeleton in like 1,000 years or whatever they'll know your REAL gender
archeologists in 1,000 years when they dig up my remains and find a SPOOKY SCARY SKELETON:
:::
14
Cromalin [she/her] - 2.3yr
shivers down my spine even just at the thought
12
SerLava [he/him] - 2.3yr
WHAT GENDER AM I?? YYAH KYA KYA KYA KYAAAA
10
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
"am i really trans?" i don't know what it means to be "really trans" but calling myself a girl in my head is the first time in 20+ years i have ever respected myself so fuck it I'll keep doing it
13
kristina [she/her] - 2.3yr
I respect the troops
And stand for the flag
10
Pluto [he/him, he/him] - 2.3yr
I may be trans, I think, but idk
13
kristina [she/her] - 2.3yr
11
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
Hi, welcome & tell us more if you wish!
10
Pluto [he/him, he/him] - 2.3yr
Sure. Just not sure if I fit anywhere. Is non-binary trans? Eh, maybe. I don't know.
I may be genderqueer or non-binary. Definitely autigender.
9
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
Of course, yes! Also you fit here
11
Pluto [he/him, he/him] - 2.3yr
Noice! I will keep looking into this stuff.
7
kristina [she/her] - 2.3yr
I'm definitely of the opinion that enbies are trans, though some don't identify with the label
8
Pluto [he/him, he/him] - 2.3yr
I just don't know what to do with the info that I'm trans. Do I go through surgery? I don't want to. I, err, like my body, so to speak; it has more to do with the fact that I don't like masculinity, I guess.
6
kristina [she/her] - 2.3yr
Sometimes it doesn't have to do anything with medically transitioning. It can also be unprogramming certain behaviors that you think are unhelpful, voice work, and presentation. Some people can also feel ok the way they are
I'm personally a very binary and a typical trans woman, so I'm not exactly the best on explaining enby experiences, but I can help if you need any info
7
Pluto [he/him, he/him] - 2.3yr
Thank you!
Yes, I don't really want to transition right now.
I've just never felt like a typical "man."
5
kristina [she/her] - 2.3yr
I do tend to recommend people that are playing with their gender to try voice work. At minimum, its a cool party trick to make yourself sound androgynous, masc, or feminine. At best, it can make you feel a lot more comfortable and may make you better at singing. It also has low social impact (people can't see youre experimenting), you can just use it when you feel comfortable. Usually within a couple months of daily practice you can have some really noticeable gains.
6
Ceres [she/her] - 2.3yr
8
Pluto [he/him, he/him] - 2.3yr
Hello, fellow dwarf planet.
8
kristina [she/her] - 2.3yr
13
Angel [any] - 2.3yr
Yesterday, I felt gender euphoria for the first time in ages. My hair is constantly getting longer and longer, and my freeform dreads looked in a way that made me feel much more feminine than usual. I'm also 6 months into HRT, and I'm just noticing changes that are there, but I can't quite pinpoint what they are. My eyes are definitely seeing things differently. It was a good vibe even though I still have quite a long way to go before I'm truly as feminine as I want to be. It definitely, at the very least, is a nice break from how much I've been hating how "mannish" my eyes have been perceiving myself recently.
12
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
Always love when you can trust your eyes & see beautiful things (yourself, looking good) through them
3
Tommasi [she/her, pup/pup's] - 2.3yr
Before I decided to transition, I was nervous that if I did it would change "me", but actually the opposite has happened. I realised earlier this week that I feel more like myself than I have in years. This is how I used to be before. Me without all the pretending and bitterness and fear and all the other bs that hid away the person I actually am.
It's nice. I used to like the person I was, and I'm realising that's always been me, just hiding away under a bunch of failed coping mechanism. I supressed so much of my behaviours and wants because they weren't "masculine". I'm not changing into someone else, I'm finally able to be my authentic self, and it's amazing to recognize that part of myself after so many years of denying it.
12
BountifulEggnog [it/its, she/her] - 2.3yr
It was a little jarring to get together with some of my guy friends and they were talking about weight/lifting and then they started teasing me for being small (I'm objectively not). I never realized how much being large was tied up in masculinity. Like obviously being tall would be, but I didn't realize how much weight was. They all just wanted to bulk up and get huge.
...and I just don't.
::: spoiler cw for body hatred and ED
I'm always missing the days of when I was smaller, even if I wasn't any healthier. I hate how big and gross I feel.
:::
::: spoiler worried about being trans
I'm scared. I don't want to be trans. Why can't these feelings just go away. I don't know if I'm a transwoman but I'm still scared. Why can't I just be a normal guy. I hate society. If it weren't for this FUCKING SOCIETY it would all be okay. I could shave, I could dress how I want, maybe even give hrt a spin. But I can't. Its just too hard. I'm crying. I hate gender. Goodnight Hexbear. Sorry for the trauma dump, this one got out of hand.
:::
12
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler Trans Mega, but I terrify you with nonsense
The only thing I have desired in my adult life is to talk about books I like with people. How hard can that possibly be, right?
Dante Must Die Mode. It seems like 95% of the time I'd be more productive holding people up at gunpoint and treating it like an interrogation. Sucks to suck; the precious few times I've been able to do it, that shit's like a drug. Please, I beg of you, we can talk about this forever, I have headcanons and fundamental misunderstandings!
Something that's been rolling around my head for years now is that, in Nevada by Imogen Binnie Orange Book Bad, there's this one bit where Maria Griffiths in her narration observes some total bullshit about genderqueer identities, which is not epic and I'm actually gonna cw for transphobia:
QUOTE
Not to mention, if you are a total baby panda at Internet communities asking, like, How do I get hormones, Internet trans women are very nice: they will tell you. But when you ask a more complicated question, like say, how do you resolve a genderqueer identity with a female identity when it seems like acknowledging the restraints of female identity and then bursting them doesn’t make you no longer female, just empowered, and therefore is genderqueer a privileged identity that’s mostly available to female-assigned people with punk rock haircuts, in college, everybody gets all butt-hurt and you get in trouble.
ENDQUOTE
Wow, I should post literal Nevada quotes online more often. This is fun!!
Anyway on its face this is stupid for a whole fucking mess of reasons I'm pretty sure, like Orange Book Bad itself references Gender Outlaw once or twice, (slightly dimly, fwiw) and this kind of read is noooot compatible with Bornstein's read of gender as a class system. Ah yes, a non-cis identity is privileged and only available to one assigned gender...? Fuck off with that. It's sort-of consistent with Binnie's short I Met A Girl Named Bat in 2012's The Collection as well, which uses "both genders" once, maybe just for the sake of being an asshole.
The thing is, I have constantly wondered if I am missing something, or this is a bit or whatever, like an inside joke.This read feels kind of fucking stupid, but I don't have any other evidence by which to prove or disprove its shittiness. You can also observe that most people would rightly not bother, and dismiss it as a dogshit take. I'm slightly biased though, if Orange Book Bad is shitty, I desire to know exactly on what level and why.
Another factor is that someone could crawl out of the woodwork and be like "I lived next to a trans girl who said she was friends with Binnie, its actually a brilliant deliberate example of what an immovably awful person Maria is, Binnie said so" or something like that. I have low knowledge about this specific brainrot subject of books, so that's a possibility. I only want to understand shit.
:::
12
Cromalin [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler i like talking books!
now i still haven't read nevada, BUT i do have some knowledge on (some permutations of) this discourse. i could definitely see this being an intentional she's an asshole thing, but it's not unheard of for trans women to have problems with this sort of thing. this specifically reads as truscum rhetoric (especially given it sitting right next to "how do i get hormones" which kinda frames hrt and medical transition as the good trans and genderqueer afab people as the bad ones) but even outside truscum spaces there are some transfem people who are very bitter about transmisogyny and lash out at trans people who they see as more privileged (the bitterness isn't unjustified but obviously taking it out on other trans people like that is) and who are viewed as perpetuating transmisogyny (which many tme people do but like, that doesn't make them not trans)
one specific complaint is that these genderqueer afab people are often just seen as women by society at large and therefore don't have to face the level of transphobia of more binary trans people, especially trans women. ti ve clear this is bullshit, genderqueer identities being seen as just quirky women is itself pretty self evidently transphobia. while i am not entirely unsympathetic to some of the things that lead to this line of thinking (there are obviously some genderqueer people who enact transmisogyny, even if there are obviously way more cis people who do) it is still incredibly harmful and any transmisogyny in tme trans spaces can and must be addressed in ways that do not invalidate other people's transness. the term "theyfab" (which i don't like and think is bad) is used by some in this context. sometimes it's to make a specific point about, for example, spaces that exclude amab trans people but welcome afab trans people (a real problem! still doesn't justify what feels to me like tacit misgendering) but sometimes it's just a derogatory way to talk about the group and implicitly deny their transness
anyways that's where i feel like this is coming from. obviously cannot promise this is specifically what's going on, and im very tired so i might be missing something or communicating poorly. lotta discourse, im not an expert, but that's the vibes i get. hope this was helpful, im going to sleep now so if it wasn't i can't help
6
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler aw yiss!!!
Yes, that was my instant assumption too. It reads very similarly to "just woman-lite" arguments used against nonbinary people. It's sickeningly ironic in this case because Orange Book Bad references Bornstein and Serano, it's how I was introduced to Gender Outlaw and Whipping Girl, so it's not like the author is unaware? Which, I don't really desire to CANCEL IMOGEN BINNIE or whatever, the trouble is that Maria Griffiths kind of seems like a self insert in many ways, oops. It blows me away that a binary trans person could see genders outside the binary as being privileged, lol. The main reason I lean away from the theoretical "It's deliberate, it's about how Maria is an asshole!" argument is that for pretty much every other bit of blogosphere-quasi-lecturing-narration, Maria says very agreeable stuff and it seems like the reader is meant to agree so Idk.
Even if it were true that gq afab people were "just seen as women by society" that would not make them exempt from transphobia and discrimination anyway, yes!!!! You know what though, Nevada does have a lil passage about spaces that allow afab trans people but not amab:
God no, Maria says. Are you kidding? How am I going to do that, and how am I going to do that with my junk the way it is, and anyway: bio-cock.
Piranha spends a lot of her time reading the Internet, so she’s super up on, like, everything. She probably doesn’t go to sex parties, although Maria hasn’t asked. But she’s talked a lot about this thing where there are lesbian sex parties that happen in the city and how they will often have No Bio-Cock Policies, meaning, No Trans Women. Or, optimistically, Trans Women: Keep Your Pants On. Meanwhile trans guys are welcome to brandish whatever cocks they want. Kind of frustrating, kind of problematic, and deeply representative of Maria’s own issues with her junk—even if she’s never actually had a partner who had issues around it. The term bio-cock has become shorthand for the fact that trans women aren’t sexually welcome in any communities anywhere.
Of course the text is sort of unrelentingly shitty about it, and also I have never heard the term which is probably a gen x thing, so that's a funny thing. Nevada is not a book that's kind to other trans people (JUST WAIT TILL YOU HEAR ABOUT ITS TAKES ON TRANS MEN!) and it's probably the aspect of it I hate the most. This is kinda like the primordial roots of the Bad Discourse that led to TME/TMA being adopted to start!
Sorry to hear that ur tired (sleep! sleep is good!) but I greatly appreciate the insight, you have connected a few dots in my brain I think. The more I look at this, the less there seems to be plausible deniability - or even if it's an intentional show of the protagonist being shitty, it's kind of going too far with it. Like, if the reader was not interested in hearing Maria's ridiculous stream of consciousness after this, I would not blame them in the slightest. Of course I have brainrot anyway, so but very good stuff.
:::
6
good_girl [she/her, they/them] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler book talk lets gooooo
I think this specific issue with Nevada is very emblematic of Imogen Binnie's brand of trans feminism (at least at the time, I can't remember if it's addressed in the second edition's afterword). The book is very white and very american, and Maria is shown to be relatively privileged. It's to the point where I don't fault anyone for not being able to read, enjoy, or relate to it for reasons past the blogpost narration.
the trouble is that Maria Griffiths kind of seems like a self insert in many ways, oops. It blows me away that a binary trans person could see genders outside the binary as being privileged, lol. The main reason I lean away from the theoretical "It's deliberate, it's about how Maria is an asshole!" argument is that for pretty much every other bit of blogosphere-quasi-lecturing-narration, Maria says very agreeable stuff and it seems like the reader is meant to agree so Idk.
I do kinda get that feeling of Maria being a self-insert in many ways which kinda taints the book a bit. However I also see Maria as a great example of "bad representation" in that while her character embodies some important parts of the trans experience, she's still a somewhat problematic and messy individual who exemplifies the parts of the trans experience that aren't spotlighted anywhere else. Whether it's intentional or not is definitely arguable and it definitely wasn't necessary to tell the story Imogen Binnie wanted to write, but I think that it could also just a product of the time it was written in.
Wow, I should post literal Nevada quotes online more often. This is fun!!
:::
4
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler ayooooo!!
Yes indeed, Nevada is a 0 intersectionalism text, which is deeply annoying since it's half a cultural touchstone. It's weird too because a few times Maria does point out stuff like say, getting the benefit of the doubt for being tall, white and attractive, but it's kind of nothing more than lipservice when shit like the above is being said too. I actually dunno how much I could recommend it anymore tbh...
She works the same job that Imogen Binnie did, the Camp Trans/Michigan Womyns Festival shit is definitely a Binnie thing 'cause iirc she met some Topside writers there irl, I have always considered her to be a mouthpiece. You are right though about the "bad representation" thing, and I think that's why Nevada has such staying power. (with me, at least, lmao) Maria sucks so bad and I love her, I never get tired of seeing her total all of her relationships and fuck everything up 'cause she's all messed up and sad the abrasiveness is part of the appeal, right?
I just kinda feel like the shit she says about genderqueer people and trans men are over the line, from "messy and problematic" to "divisive wrecker", I guess. I have seen it put people off once or twice, and I'm not convinced the book would not be improved if you just cut this bs about trans men "taking up space from trans women" and whatever.
Also it's weird because Nevada being big means that a lot of subsequently influenced trans fiction (Detransition Baby, Tell Me I'm Worthless, Manhunt) lean into the whole, gen-x-transfemme-who-browsed-fictionmania thing a lot, which I think is a bit quaint to most people now. It's definitely unique!
Actually unironically, if I'd known this was gonna go so well I would have aired my grievances with Nevada way sooner. This thread is great & everyone in it is lovely
:::
4
khizuo [ze/zir] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler my two cents i guess
as a tme trans person with some passing familiarity in this discourse i don’t feel particularly offended by these kinds of comments because I know that because of transmisogyny i have structural privilege over tma trans people. so a transfemme making a snarky comment about trans men or afab gq people, even if it dips into some unideal “invalidating gender” territory, isn’t nearly on the same level as the violent transmisogyny that gets perpetrated from those groups.
i’ve yet to read whipping girl which is on my reading list but i think serano discusses the divide between tme/tma trans people a bit too. ultimately i think it’s more important for us tme trans people to deal with transmisogyny in our communities first, because these kinds of comments are just a reaction to the dynamics of unrecognized privilege and violent exclusion in these transmisogynistic trans spaces. idk, just my thoughts though and i don’t want to invalidate your experience with nevada especially as I haven’t read it.
:::
4
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler lfg!!!
Hi, I welcome any thoughts on this subject!
I'm glad at least to see that the quotes aren't that offensive to their targets, lol. I agree that it's nothing like the violent transmisogyny we experience, to me I guess it's about yet more divisive shit in the trans community, and also maybe that anger could be directed at dogshit cis people who commit the vast majority of that violent transmisogyny, instead of our comrades? It seems kind of bastardy to be bitterly invalidating people's genders instead? Down with cis? Just spitballing, Idk. I don't disagree with your comment overall, I appreciate the alternate view actually. Doesn't invalidate my experience :)
Man I still gotta read Whipping Girl, look at me being a genderlib and not reading theory!
:::
4
good_girl [she/her, they/them] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler more book more book
Oh! I just remembered!
These last two comments reminded me about a specific part of Whipping Girl that I think can elaborate a bit on the kind of thinking that informed Imogen Binnie and possibly led to these views.
In the last chapter of Whipping Girl, Serano touches on the topic of subversivism within the feminist movements of the time (90s to the early 10's).
There's quite a bit more than what I've put below, but I remember feeling conflicted when I first finished this chapter. Obviously today definitions have changed and the idea of political lesbians and genderqueer identities has shifted. I wanted to understand more after finishing the book in regards to this topic but the trans spaces I looked in were severely lacking in even basic transmisogyny discussion, so I had no hope of finding more on it.
::: spoiler Passages attached
The practice of subversivism also negatively impacts trans people on the
MTF spectrum. After all, in our culture, the meanings of “bold,” “rebellious,”
and “dangerous”—adjectives that often come to mind when considering
subversiveness—are practically built into our understanding of masculinity. In
contrast, femininity conjures up antonyms like “timid,” “conventional,” and
“safe,” which seem entirely incompatible with subversion. Therefore, despite
the fact that the mainstream public tends to be more concerned and disturbed
by MTF spectrum trans people than their FTM spectrum counterparts,
subversivism creates the impression that trans masculinities are inherently
“subversive” and “transgressive,” while their trans feminine counterparts are
“lame” and “conservative” in comparison. Subversivism’s privileging of trans
masculinities over trans femininities helps to explain why cissexual queer
women and FTM spectrum folks tend to dominate the queer/trans community:
Their exceptional gender expressions and identities are routinely empowered
and encouraged in such settings. In contrast, there is generally a dearth of MTF
spectrum folks who regularly inhabit queer/trans spaces.
To me, the most surreal part of this whole transgressingversus-reinforcing-
gender-norms dialogue in the queer/trans community (and in many gender
studies classrooms and books) is the unacknowledged hypocrisy of it all. It is
sadly ironic that people who claim to be gender-fucking in the name of
“shattering the gender binary,” and who criticize people whose identities fail
to adequately challenge our societal notions of femaleness and maleness,
cannot see that they have just created a new gender binary, one in which
subversive genders are “good” and conservative genders are “bad.” In a sense,
this new gender binary isn’t even all that new. It is merely the original
oppositional sexist binary flipped upside down. So now, gender-
nonconforming folks are on top and gender-normative people are on the bottom
—how revolutionary! Now, I understand the temptation for a marginalized
group to turn the hierarchy that has oppressed them upside down, as it can feel
very empowering to finally be atop the pecking order, but it’s absurd to claim
that such approaches in any way undermine that binary. If anything, they only
serve to reinforce it further.
I believe that if the transgender movement had simply continued to view
itself as an alliance of disparate groups working toward a shared goal (like
making the world safer for gender-variant folks), it may have avoided such
exclusivity while respecting the distinct differences and specific concerns of
its various constituents. Instead, by promoting the idea that we must move
beyond the supposedly outdated concept of “identity,” the transgender
movement has created its own sense of “oneness.” Rather than viewing
ourselves as a fragile political coalition of distinct subgroups, some activists
instead encourage us to see ourselves as one big homogeneous group of
individuals who blur gender boundaries. Rather than learning to respect the
very different perspectives and experiences that each transgender subgroup
brings to the table, the transgender community has instead become a sort of
gender free-for-all, where identities are regularly co-opted by others within
the community. These days, many transs*xuals assume that they have the right
to appropriate the language of, or speak on behalf of, intersex people;
similarly, many cissexual genderqueers feel they have the right to do the same
for transs*xuals. This needlessly erases each group’s unique issues, obstacles,
and perspectives.
This sort of “gender anarchy”—where individuals are free to adopt or
appropriate any identity as they please—might seem very limitless and freeing
on the surface, but in practice it resembles gender-libertarianism, where those
who are most marginalized become even more vulnerable to the whims of
those who are more established. In this case, it leaves those of us who are
cross-gender-identified susceptible to negation at the hands of the greater
cissexual queer community. Indeed, it has become increasingly common for
people who are primarily queer because of their sexual orientation to claim a
space for themselves within the transgender movement.7 This is particularly
true in the queer women’s community, which has become increasingly involved
in transgender politics and discourses due to the recent sharp increase in the
number of (1) previously lesbian-identified people transitioning to male, (2)
dykes who now take on genderqueer or other FTM spectrum identities, and (3)
non-trans queer women who seek a voice in the transgender community
because they are partnered to FTM spectrum individuals.
Because of our history, the fact that cissexual queers now dominate
transgender and queer/trans communities and discourses is highly problematic
for those of us who are transs*xual.
:::
2
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
does anyone have any good resources on trying to look for housing as a trans person? like, i feel like i should put up a craigslist posting saying something like "pre everything trans femme looking for queer roommates" or something but idk what i should/shouldn't do or what to look out for
11
good_girl [she/her, they/them] - 2.3yr
is my voice supposed to be breathy during voice training? i feel like i'm targeting the right muscles for resonance but idk. wish there was a more understandable timeline for it
11
kristina [she/her] - 2.3yr
Yes it is kinda breathy until you build up your muscles in the top of your throat. Have some protein after practicing too. Be sure you're not doing falsetto. You should get up to falsetto and be in the notch just below it and build that up
It took me 3-4 months of daily practice, usually 1-2 hrs per day to get anywhere on the voice
11
good_girl [she/her, they/them] - 2.3yr
Okay wow this helps a ton, thank you.
I really wish online resources were more than "just tighten your throat and da da da da congrats you have feminized your voice"
7
kristina [she/her] - 2.3yr
No problem. I also suggest finding a phrase and sticking to that to practice. Like a short song or something, but just say the words in your speaking voice. Then stick to that for all of your voice training going forward, and also record yourself and compare to previous attempts. This will help you target the right muscles and build them up.
If you feel your voice is still too low, don't be discouraged. As you build those muscles up you get better control of them and can slowly squeeze it higher and higher over time. Try not to force anything, straining your voice can really hurt and put you out of commission for days
7
Pisha [she/her, they/them] - 2.3yr
There are some good and some bad international news I'd like to talk about: In Germany, a self-id law is likely to pass parliament in the next days. It's not ideal (mandatory consultation for minors, no binary passports for nonbinary people, no transfem gender marker change during wartime, some dogwhistle-y sentences without legal meaning), but at least they struck the part about automatically reporting every gender marker change to the police. It replaces an older law which required two psychiatric evaluations costing thousands of Euros, so that's good.
On the bad side, in the UK the Cass review was published. It's a "systematic" review of gender care for minors and unsurprisingly, it comes to the conclusion that minors should not get gender-affirming care. Even social transition should not happen without a doctor supervising it. It was obviously planned as a hatchet job from the very beginning by choosing unqualified doctors with clear anti-trans position to write it. As always, the media is failing its duty to accurately report on institutional transphobia while Labour is loudly embracing it. The NHS is now planning to do the same thing with adult gender care, so I can only express my horror at the continuing decline of TERF island.
11
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
kind of want to "retire" this account for no other reason than i want to change my username to something aggressively transfemme. I have something in mind so far but I'm still kind of hesitant with it for some reason
11
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
me bugging my friends after i've been feeling dysphoric all day
11
RedQuestionAsker2 [he/him, she/her] - 2.3yr
Why did I waste years of my life as an egg?
I know you all knew!
10
Tommasi [she/her, pup/pup's] - 2.3yr
If you gaze long enough into the estrogen, the estrogen will gaze back into you.
10
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
i find it a bit strange in hindsight to ask when the exact "day" i figured out i was trans was. Like, there is a day where I really did say "oh damn none of this is cis" but for the two-three months before that i was obviously in so much denial it was degrading. I was doing/saying just... unbelievably eggy things that really just didn't have a cisgender explanation to them but I still 100% totally believed were "still cis though". I think of it like "what radicalized you", because no one even ever turns some squishy liberal into a hardened communist in a day, that shit takes years
10
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
Sometimes I look down when I'm reading a book or whatever and I'm like "ayo, boobs, incredible!" you would think after nearly a decade the novelty woulda worn off, but uh I guess I'll never get tired of the "soft curve". Hydrodynamic, as Maryam calls it...
Why though? I'm kinda like, if gender is hugely culturally constructed, why so pleased to have boobs? They do not do anything, they're arguably inconvenient? Idgi, but my brain sure does.
One of the weird things about my existence is that I didn't really spend a second thinking about it when I first discovered what transition was, I just went "k imma girl now" and followed my gut. Good instinct, very cool of me, but it means I have done almost zero critical thinking about my own gender, ig.
10
Jenniferrr [she/her, comrade/them] - 2.3yr
Back to work... aaaaaannnddddd my anxiety is back haha. I wish I could take a month off work.
On a totally seperare note the trader Joe's daily facial sunscreen is so comfortable. Not too expensive either my plan is to wear it for laser treatment but just a heads up!
10
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
oh what do you mean i only got the HRT appointment done 3 days ago i could have sworn it's been like 2 months already
10
RedQuestionAsker2 [he/him, she/her] - 2.3yr
I would like the input of the experienced and wise trans sages of hexbear.
I've been going through a years long process of gender experimentation that has intensified lately. I feel like something just hasn't clicked for me yet.
There are times when I'm perfectly happy to be a non-gender conforming man, and there are other times when I feel the call of the woman very strongly. There are times when I really like having a beard and getting bigger as I increase my muscle mass. I want to clarify that I like these things. It's not just default to me. But there are other times where these same features (mostly the facial hair) fucking kill me. Then there are other in-between times where I don't feel feminine but I wish I did, and I just get sad that I don't feel that way.
I've been going by she/her at home lately, and sometimes it feels good, and other times it doesn't. Most of the time, it just feels fake (I know this is normal).
Sometimes I really want to try HRT, and other times I'm scared of the permanent changes. While the idea of having a vagina seems cool, I actually don't want to get rid of my penis.
I could be experiencing some kind of bigender or gender fluid thing, but honestly, the emotional whiplash is just exhausting. I'm trying my best to just enjoy who I am at the time, regardless of whether it's masculine or feminine, but this makes me feel like I'm using femininity and womanhood like a costume instead an actual gender identity (okay, now that I'm typing this out, I'm seeing similarities to a lot of other trans people).
Am I having a unique experience, or is this just regular dysphoria stuff? Tbh, I feel kind of fraudulent hanging out here sometimes.
10
kristina [she/her] - 2.3yr
Also being scared of the unknown, permanent changes is very common.
12
kristina [she/her] - 2.3yr
Cw discussion of dysphoria
::: spoiler spoiler
This sounds a bit like gender fluidity. Generally the rule of thumb is to transition to fix your lows for gender fluid people. If you feel suicidal over something, it's better to fix that than to feel good about something later, if that makes sense. Suicide is very permanent
But it's really important to measure how you feel when going about hrt for gender fluid and nonbinary people. I would suggest keeping a journal of your thoughts, what you were doing that day, and see if anything triggers the desire to feel one way or the other. Keep doing this, then if you think you've found a pattern,try something new, and then measure that.
Id like to point out that I'm very binary, but this is advice a genderfluid person I know gave to someone else. In general it seems hellish to me, you never really get rid of dysphoria completely if you are gender fluid.
For me as a trans woman, I never really felt good about my masculine characteristics. Muscularity id argue isn't necessarily one, but beards and so on are. Id even argue feeling fine about your penis is common enough for trans women. I could understand when I looked good to other people, but never felt that way myself, it felt like something was just off about it. It felt like my eyes never had any light in them, I couldn't figure out how to smile naturally, I felt like my skull was weird, my skin felt wrong (like it didn't have enough fat under it or something,or the texture was wrong). I felt kinda perpetually disgusted about all the tiny things T does to you
:::
8
RedQuestionAsker2 [he/him, she/her] - 2.3yr
Thank you for your insight, as always
::: spoiler dysphoria
In general it seems hellish to me, you never really get rid of dysphoria completely if you are gender fluid.
Not going to lie, I just kept reading this sentence over and over, and I had to get up and walk around because I felt like I was gonna barf. Because yeah, it kind of feels like that. Anyway, that sudden spike in dysphoria is actually instructive for me. I'll follow the signal and reflect on why I feel that way.
It felt like my eyes never had any light in them, I couldn't figure out how to smile naturally, I felt like my skull was weird, my skin felt wrong (like it didn't have enough fat under it or something,or the texture was wrong). I felt kinda perpetually disgusted about all the tiny things T does to you
I notoriously don't smile. Like, that's a thing about me that people comment on. My wife, unprompted, has said that I just look happier when I'm presenting femme. I smile in the mirror more when I'm femme. Also, random people and friends compliment me when I'm dressed femme. When dressed femme, I get more compliments in a week than I probably ever have in a lifetime of dressing masc. I also just generally feel a wider range of emotions when femme.
I'm also grossed out by a lot of T stuff. My skin, in particular feels wrong. Body hair, etc.
But it's really important to measure how you feel when going about hrt for gender fluid and nonbinary people. I would suggest keeping a journal of your thoughts, what you were doing that day, and see if anything triggers the desire to feel one way or the other. Keep doing this, then if you think you've found a pattern,try something new, and then measure that.
So, I think it's good advice to keep a journal, but I don't see the connection to HRT. Could you explain?
:::
6
kristina [she/her] - 2.3yr
So for some genderfluid people, they can have triggers that cause them to "swap" gender identity. If you measure these things you can find ways to avoid "swapping".
Again, just spit balling here, but measuring your mood, what you did, what seemed to trigger dysphoria, you might figure out if you're that flavor of gender fluid. Your experience is definitely out of the norm for a trans woman, but it could be you have hangups that are cultural too that are confusing it. (Re: muscularity, women with penises) It's possible you could be a lot of things
I think the important thing is to try to measure stuff so you have a more concrete list of things going on. For example I helped a xenogender person irl that seemed to have swaps based on sunlight, turns out the swap was based on vitamin d and taking that helped them stay more towards one identity
7
RedQuestionAsker2 [he/him, she/her] - 2.3yr
turns out the swap was based on vitamin d and taking that helped them stay more towards one identity
That's fucking wild
you measure these things you can find ways to avoid "swapping".
I don't want to avoid swapping all together because I like the expression, but having more control would be helpful.
Thank you so much
7
khizuo [ze/zir] - 2.3yr
Hmm. While I am fully committed to wanting to medically transition now, it actually took me a while to reach that conclusion because I had a period of a few months literally right before my initial "oh shit" gender questioning moment when I had finally begun to feel like maybe I would be happy being a girl. (Needless to say... I did not stay a girl.)
::: spoiler dysphoria talk
I'm not a binary trans person, but I also am pretty set in my non-binary experience of gender, and it very distinctly isn't in any way related to my agab (I get a lot of dysphoria when gendered as a girl/woman.)
However, for a while when I was first questioning, I thought that I didn't experience a lot of physical dysphoria, just social dysphoria. As a result, I thought that maybe I didn't want to medically transition because I, too, was scare of permanent changes. So during this questioning phase, there were times when I quite liked my more "feminine" body, and times when I wished I had different fat distribution. There were times when I liked my boobs and times when I hated how much they gendered me. But the more I got misgendered, the more uncomfortable I got, and I began to solidify both my experience of physical dysphoria and how I wanted to transition. I know some nonbinary people are okay with getting read as their agab, but I really wasn't.
All in all, it took my about two years to fully decide that I wanted to medically transition, which is where I'm at now. There are still some things that I don't really want to change, though. I very much do not want a penis, so I never pack and I have no intention of getting phalloplasty. Top surgery is still somewhat of a toss-up that I've been waffling on for a while, but I think I'm starting to come down on the side of "yeah get these off" (frankly I wish for velcro boobs, but I think that it's easier for me to just fake having boobs when I want them rather than to bind when I don't.) I also do not really want to pass as a cis manly man, I just really want to stop getting gendered as a woman (which all strangers do to me. I do not pass at all.) Really, what I want is to be confusing.
Idk if any of this helps but I thought I would just word vomit a little. It would be really nice if we could just shapeshift at will, lol.
:::
7
RedQuestionAsker2 [he/him, she/her] - 2.3yr
Idk if any of this helps
It does. A lot. So many of your thoughts parallel my own perfectly, so it's nice to see it expressed.
I really wish we could just shapeshift.
One major issue for me is I really can't imagine myself as an old woman. I want to be a bearded old dude, so I don't want to get rid of my beard or detransition and have testosterone issues in my old age. Maybe it's just deep brainworms acting up considering how women are treated like garbage the more they age while men are treated like a fine wine idk. Maybe if I take your route, I'll figure out what I actually want. Maybe it wouldn't actually bother me.
But RIGHT NOW, the push to feminize is quite strong. I've still got like 3 decades before I'd consider myself an old man. Do I just take half measures and repress during that time? I don't know.
6
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
also funny in retrospect is how easy it was to finally get rid of the "why does it feel like it's literally impossible to look in the mirror and feel attractive?" feelings that i've had for as long as I can remember because all I did was:
put on $5 bralette
toss flannel on over it without closing it (literally one of the flannels i've always worn everyday for fuck knows how many years)
mentally apply the girl curves filter
and I was asking "Uhm, Hel-lo Ma'am??? 😳 before i even got to step 3. by that point i had to sit down what the fuck what do you mean it was this easy????
9
Grace [she/her] - 2.3yr
Being trans is like a keep trying not to die challenge every day forever, it is hard not to become bitter.
9
SexUnderSocialism [she/her] - 2.3yr
9
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
sometimes i wonder if i'm really "trans" or not. i always respond to that by recalling just how long i genuinely, desperately, earnestly tried to be a cis man
it didn't fuckin work, and i need to remember that
8
🎀 Seryph (She/Her) - 2.3yr
Switching to patches from pills tomorrow now that I don't need to hide my being trans from anyone I live with. Is there any particularly good spot to place it or am I fine just putting it on my thigh?
8
DerEwigeAtheist [she/her, comrade/them] - 2.3yr
I heard places with thinner skin and more blood near the surface are good, like inner thighs.
4
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
Welcome to hell, losers. I hate to be doing this, but I gotta. Discussion of Unjust Depths 13.8, ft. a side of sexual topics:
::: spoiler Open mouth, insert foot...
I hate Karuniya Maharapratham.
Die, Chaser Scum: An Essay (not really)
All of Karuniya and Murati’s scenes together in Arc 1, like up to book 3 when the Brigand departs, no problems no questions. Usage of gendered terms like "prince" and "husband material" spooked me, but I’m weird so sure, Murati is a tomboy, no big. I’m certain it’s just a Gender thing. Then there's that one time we get to follow Karuniya onboard the Brigand doing her science-y shit, she seems maybe a little sex-brained but whatever, it's not like that's a cardinal sin, okay. It is at that point though that the suspicions start to rise, because the way she uses "fuck" feels like it has a very specific charge. But still, sure, ok, no big.
By the time book 8 has rolled around and we get a Karuniya-POV flashback, I was all excited! Finally, she can become her own character! She spends it either condescending Murati’s ideological commitments through narration, or thinking about fat cock.
I was already primed to hate Karuniya for her dim view of Murati's little protest, when she chains herself to the simulator doors and demands 24/7 access and proper training so that academy students have a proper chance to become pilots. Great Murati moment; Karuniya’s reaction to this is mostly bemused and mean-spirited, thinking about possible physical ways to remove her, wishing to see every second that she’s on those doors, for her "entertainment". Like it's cute that she gets thinking about commitment to causes or whatever as a result of this but, you slanderous snake. Grrrr.
The vast majority of this flashback is spent on their first-ever date though, and oh man. Does Karu ever think about anything other than girldick?
She was 20 years old, in the middle of her undergraduate education and on a date with a cool, handsome upperclassman whom, it was rumored, boasted out of this world dick game.
I don’t even wanna know what “dick game” means lol. She also has mind-space to think about “pegging” though, I guess:
"I wonder if she would let me peg her."
Might be embarrassing myself here but I have only ever heard that particular term used for dudes, Idk. Even if you can square that it’s still weird though, Like sure Karuniya cares about Murati's career aspirations blah blah, but she goes into their date all dick dick dick dick dick and nothing else. Weird-ass cumbrained motherfucker.
Look right, Alexandra Genivov is a horny lady. Hell, Adelheid and Norn are basically doing a brat/brat tamer bit 24/7, and I still like those three. A lot, actually; Genivov's intro is kind of uncomfortable sure, but her thing with de la Rosa and how they nudge back and forth about their hobbies is cute! Similarly I know who Adelheid is outside of just being horny too, like her thoughts whenever they're tearing through that station and Adelheid is all concerned for Norn’s safety, or when Adelheid brings Norn back out of the Aer stream with her psy powers this very chapter right? I know that Adelheid is not just a freak about Norn because we've spent time in her head, seen how she feels generally. Hell, even given that I thought Adelheid’s dick-questioning was a bit strange, the whole subsequent scene coming after Norn was brooding in the shower is actually a great moment for them both. Yas, praetorian, slay, take out ur frustrations on that silly bitch(with aftercare)! Genivov only even has like three scenes before this chapter and I still have a better sense for who she is! Actually funnily enough, Genivov is having some silly character moments right after this, too. Her horny gamer bit is genuinely not that eye-rolling. "It'd be such a bottom move" is actually kinda funny, it would be a bottom move not to land that torpedo in time with the artillery round.
With Karuniya, literally all she does is think about dick, it seems. The one time we've been allowed to follow her perspective on the Brigand and hear about her thoughts, her occupation and stuff... gets interrupted with her thinking about dick. Rrrrrgh why is it like this, it’s worse because Murati is really charming in this flashback.
Also though Karuniya is a neurotypical; I get that there are gonna be neurotypicals in this best-selling webnovel, but it's so painfully weird to watch her internally commentate her own date and bitch at Murati, picking over her every word and griping at her alleged social gaffes:
Logistics huh? What's going on in that head of yours, Murati Nakara...
Karuniya found her extremely charming.
‘Teehee you’re so quirky, fuck me already!’ I hate this. Karuniya just does not stop with the “Play hard-to-get for a bit” and wanting to “poke fun” at Murati, she’s so fucking weird. No other character in this webnovel so far has actively repulsed me just with their manner of speaking, which puts Karuniya below Sawyer and Selene on the Unjust Depths Shit Character List.
It gets worse, though:
"You've been looking, so what do you think? Ladies love it when you flatter their ego."
My reaction in order was 1) die neurotypical bitch, 2) am I fucking mistaken, isn’t the person you are talking to also a lady??? Are you just deliberately being a freak, what is your conception of Murati, Karuniya, do I even want to know? Karuniya is apparently oblivious though, so when Murati kindly tries to let it slide unacknowledged, Karuniya must bring it up again, as if for effect:
"A lady loves to hear herself talked about in exacting detail."
Murati laughed a little. "I'm a lady too, you know."
"It's the principle- it's the principle of the thing, you understand."
I feel so fucking bad for Murati here. I get that the bit here is likely supposed to be that Murati is an oblivious dork and Karuniya is enjoying prodding her, it’s supposed to be cute, but instead this scene reads like Karuniya has made a social gaffe of APOCALYPTIC proportions, Murati tried to let it slide, but Karuniya just cannot stop being fucking weird. Holy shit, just ask for her dick size, cut the goddamn pretense.
"So, I always thought you were a really popular girl, a queen bee." Murati said. "I didn't think I merited your attention."
Karuniya giggled. She reached her hand across the table and briefly poked Murati's.
She is cute, but she's such a dork. How does she not see herself in the mirror?
What the hell is that even supposed to mean? Coincidentally this exchange is not helping Karuniya to beat the neurotypical allegations, I’m pretty sure “queen bee” does not have a positive connotation. What is it about what Murati said that was dorky? ^I^ ^don’t^ ^understand^ ^people...^ And one more, just to rub in how shitty and weird Karuniya is:
"Did you know there's rumours about you among the girls at the Academy, Murati Nakara?"
Was it the alcohol? Was it bringing out the sadist in her? Why did she say that?
WHY INDEED YOU ABSOLUTE FREAK, holy shit if I were Murati I'd be having a fucking panic attack, I'd be paranoid for fucking WEEKS.
Why exactly Murati wants to have sex with this woman after that, what the fuck she sees in this painfully unaware neurotypical fucker, is beyond me. That’s the lead-in to them fucking after the date, though; I must be missing something. After that ends we get a quick look at Karuniya’s perspective about their little disagreement at Thassalid station, something about feeling lesser, but by that point it becomes kind of late for ruminating on their relationship, whatever. I already know Karuniya is a fucking weirdo, I honestly kind of don’t care what she thinks anymore.
I consider this to be Karuniya's character assassination. These are her innermost thoughts: a garbage dump. I had been very mildly suspicious of her in prior chapters, but I brushed it away because eh, I’m probably just being paranoid or weird. Her behaviour in this chapter is basically my worst possible fears made manifest though, and to me this shit casts aspersions on all previous chapters. Maybe the "husband material" thing was her being fucking weird after all, since it potentially doesn't really seem like she'd internalised Murati as "female" by their first date, based on the evidence. Fucking gross!
That was such a fucking weird interjection, too, coming just after/before Karuniya and Murati launch in the “Helios” two-pilot diver. Marina’s flashback shows us what kind of life she’s led and why she’s still motivated to fight; why did we need to know that Karuniya is a fucking freak before she deploys? The intent was probably for the backstory to strengthen their relationship textually, but that fucking backfired. You truly could have just cut that dogshit flashback, because the subsequent fight is actually fun. Helios reporting for duty, y’know, it’s like Darling in the Franxx but less horny, I guess?
From this, I halfway get the sense that the Karuniya who exists when their relationship is under pressure or on the rocks, is a fundamentally different person from the one idly daydreaming about "dick-game-out-of-this-world" or Murati fucking her roommate years ago. Maybe we will get some actual character development, as a little treat, to see how Karuniya quit being a weirdo? But the text doesn’t seem aware that she is, so I’m not hopeful.
I hate this, someone please tell me I'm wrong for feeling this and logic it out at me.
:::
8
Cromalin [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler oh no
i don't know that i can prove you wrong? i think the intention is that like, transness is so normalized in the union for most people (at least of the younger generation who grew up firmly after the revolution) that karuniya is maybe overly horny but not in a way that means anything, and starts off as very self absorbed in that flashback but we're supposed to read her as having gotten better about it by the present if that makes sense. but like. in OUR world people who act like that are definitely fetishistic at best
i will say (without having gone back and reread that chapter/flashback) i do remember thinking the purpose of the flashback was mostly to show the history of their relationship, go "hey karuniya admires murati's passion about communism and theory and stuff, here's how they got close and the strength of their bond", but yeah it doesn't seem great when laid out like that!
4
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler Oh yes, I'm sorry lmao
Haha whoops =) I did consider that, the "normalisation" angle, and yeah maybe but this shit with Karuniya also feels considerably weirder than comparable things from Norn/Adelheid or Genivov. Doesn't help that Murati often seems really uncomfortable/awkward in response to this weird shit: this flashback, the first time "husband material" is brought up. I do have my own oversensitivity in mind when I'm thinking this, but shit was eating at my brain If Karuniya has gotten better, it'd be cute if she would do that on-page instead of in secret and we have to assume it... I think it's not just that she is horny, or that she is terribly self-absorbed; it's gotta be the combination of those PLUS the fact that she has borderline nothing else going on. It throws this weird stuff into focus and I overthink and then write 2000+ words about it on bear website
I didn't exactly see them get close though? I mostly saw Karuniya being a weird, belittling, judgemental neurotypical (yes I am slandering her) about everything Murati likes and cares about, and wanting to have sex with her. The date was painfully awkward and not in a cute way... Tbh it kind of seems like even still today Karuniya is kind of weird about Murati's career pursuits. Idk, does Karuniya EVER talk to anybody other than Murati? Does she exist without Murati in the room, even? And yet she is this weird, how exactly is it that the PROTAGONIST'S WIFE has so little in the way of character traits or development?
:::
5
DyingOfDeBordom [none/use name] - 2.3yr
Hey so like I have literally 0 connection with this person other than that I just stumbled on their Reddit posts, and they seem to be a trans woman facing imminent eviction, or might be getting evicted today I guess since the post is 4 days old
idk I just thought I should maybe share their post here? since I can't imagine anywhere else on the internet being more willing to help them? idk.
again, I don't know this person but their account is like 14 years old so I imagine they're probably a real person very much in need
god i have got to stop browsing r/mtfashion it is filling my head with all sorts of bad ideas. or maybe they're good ones? idk but i feel like this much gender envy can't be good for me
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Jenniferrr [she/her, comrade/them] - 2.3yr
Found a new outfit today at a thrifty shop that is honestly fucking amazing. It's so cute. It's just also quite warm and it's getting warmer so... whatever. It's always good to find a good outfit that breaks the rut because ive been feeling very good in my baggy jeans - tank top - flannel outfit (im starting to look like a cartoon character lol).
7
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
As a balm after The Worst Post You Have Ever Seen, here is a normal chapter update:
::: spoiler Unjust Depths 8.13-8.14 spoilers
The rest of the Brigand v Antenora battle is going really well. I like the Helios' atypical combat style, the antiflooding solution to disarm Gertrude's mech was fuckin genius, and the drones going out and lighting up everyone's imaging so that Dominika can obliterate that Volkannon was rad too. I said it above but Genivov gets a lot out of this chapter. Using her goofy gamerbrain skills to coordinate her torpedo strike with de la Rosa's artillery barrage, in hopes of doing something right for once, it's a great moment when a segment of the Antenora floods like a BITCH, OOOOOOO!!! Genivov deserves that handholding, I'm so glad she turned out to be more than just a horndog. No bottom moves from our torpedo specialist, no!
Also Gertrude fucking surrendered, holy shit. The crew of the Antenora is getting their collective asses exposed, and the exposed asses are all the asses of COMPLETELY PATHETIC LOSERS, I mean imagine being High Inquisitor and losing a fight to a seafloor exploration mech. Sucks to suck!
It was good of Fan-Favourite Cuttlefish™ to help Elena reach the bridge, and I greatly approve of Elena's big declaration. She would have probably been a hundred times safer and less awkward not revealing her identity, but she has gained initiative, values and a disdain for sitting pretty while letting other people fight her battles. Idk if she has fully earned this, since she hasn't talked to Marina in ages and she's mostly just been clowned on by the security team, but it's cool & I'm hoping this jumpstarts her character. Her decision to remain onboard the Brigand even in the face of Norn the Praetorian is rad.
Poor Genrtrude is really entering her villain era now though! Like Sieglinde she doesn't really have beliefs or convictions, so it sucks to suck (again) when your gf says "no" and you lose your entire reason for being! I could sort of tell from her overbearing nature that she might not respect Elena having autonomy, but woooooow she really flipped out, she's gonna be the NO ELENA YOU ARE MINE REEEEEE abusive ex now :/ rip high inquisitor, u will be missed after Norn fucking flays your ass, lol.
Also wow though, Sieglinde is coming with the underwater commies??? Kinda hyped for that.
:::
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Cromalin [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler bury your love at goryk's gorge INDEED
the whole fight is really incredible! everyone gets their own thing to do, it rules so hard. geninov is great "it would be such a bottom move" is an incredible line and was running through my head the entire time you mentioned getting bad vibes from her earlier because it's so charming i can't imagine not liking her after that. i loved all the other little moments people got to shine, but that was my favorite. also sieglinde being so shaken by khadija that she ends up defecting is incredible, i love that so much
elena going up to the bridge and giving that whole speech and kinda dumping gertrude shoots her up many points in my book. it's really good! she's trying to become an actual person and not just royalty and i'm rooting for her! gertrude is SUCH a loser. she's so pathetic and weird about elena, and she's just so fixated on her that it makes her bad at everything else she does. she sucks but it's super juicy. this whole arc has really good drama
4
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler The title is multifaceted which is fun...
...like yo that leviathan was a cute Zachikova gf???
I know right, this arc is great for everybody. I wasn't really invested in disliking Genivov, she just weirded me out is all... but while I was already warming to her somewhat over her nightshift shenanigans, this sealed her place in the "good bitches" pantheon. I didn't mention it at the time but while I felt really bad for Shalikova when they met in the shower, it was kind of a fun scene for Genivov, lol. I actually want more from the torpedo/artillery chairs now!! It is an incredible battle, there were no goofy ass-pulls (I was expecting Shalikova to be saved by deus ex machina, but no!) Every time a Diver is onscreen it's a hype moment. Sonya is now going to see Maryam in the infirm though and OH BOY OH BOY
Yes!!! I knew she could fucking do it!!! She has to read theory now and start enjoying soy cutlets Honestly she and Gertrude traded places in my rankings, I still love Gertrude but in a "she sucks but it's super juicy" way for sure. I cannot wait to see her do Real Villain shit, this origin story is going to make her future war crimes ✨ EXTRA SPICY ✨
:::
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Cromalin [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler hell yeah
yeah she is!!!!
i didn't think you really hated her, just that she has forever been tied to that line in my mind and i had to really force myself not to make like a coy little reference to it lmao. and yeah! the fights are so fucking good, madiha is really incredible at making them work in prose, which isn't easy. i always feel like i have enough of a sense of the mechanics to follow what's happening while not getting bogged down in details. and the divers are always so hype
elena is going to do it! she will read theory, she will join the proletariat, she will start eating the food that is available to her! by the end of the story she will be having theory discussions with murati on equal terms
:::
3
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler lfg
I'm glad I did not lol, I might have introduced her with more than just her going AWOOOGA a bunch, but yeah I get ya, it's a great line, lmao. Waa it an absolute top move when her strategy worked out then?
Weirdly enough the battles kinda remind me of the Halo novels ( )It is top shelf stuff, it is tough to balance both "not getting bogged down in the details" and "detailed enough that hype still occurs", ngl though I had forgotten that the Jagd has like, an inverted triangular chassis, lol
YOOOOOOOOOOOO Oh no way, I never even considered that, I'm still slightly hesitant about our resident Dumb Bitch talking to Murati cause uh c: But I do look forward to her learning to be a real person.
:::
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Cromalin [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler unjust deoths
nah i think this is a no win scenario. the second you start saying "it would be an absolute bottom move" about stuff everything you do in response to that is also an absolute bottom move
yeah like, i don't always have a super consistent vision of the divers in my head (the jagd especially always looks like the jagd doga to me because of the name) but the fights work so well
elena will be one of the three pillars of communist thought in the union. (i mean, her becoming a real girl and not having imperial brainworms and being able to talk to poc without being weird about it is a more reasonable hope. but i like to dream big)
2
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler Deoths c:
And so, the gunnery officers were both bottoms lmao
One of the things I really want is for Marina and Elena to make up. I get why Elena is mad at her, and sure Marina is the single most brainwormed person in Unjust Depths, but I feel really incredibly bad for Marina busting her ass and devoting her life to the daughter that she, Leda and Bethany cared for so deeply, risking life and limb constantly to keep her safe, and getting that thrown back in her face. Elena should get cozy and start loving her new adoptive mother, because Bethany and Leda's wills (though hopefully not weird knifeplay forcefem habits) live on through Marina.
::: spoiler Weird Book Brainrot
To me Marina feels like she walked out of any random trans litfic, like she has many of the aspects of a Maria Griffiths or a Jules Binachi(The Last Girl Scout) or even a Wendy(Little Fish), and it's very fascinating, her brainworms should rub up very strangely against the otherwise exclusively trans-positive-trans-normative world. I felt awful sadness when Ulyana and Aaliyah were getting the report from the doctor about how Marina is basically a walking trauma bucket, I wish to see her heal in general.
:::
3
Cromalin [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler unjust deaths on everyone who makes fun of my typos
yeah for sure. marina is a deeply tragic character, she has this daughter she's estranged from, she's the only character we've seen from the republic and has SO many brainworms. it fits with the brigand because it's part of making clear how much of a hellhole the republic was, but it's so sad. i really want to see her overcome her past and both have better opinions and also just have like, anything good? what if she got exposed to a fully trans positive society and maybe bonded with people and stopped calling them commies as a bad thing!
2
Jenniferrr [she/her, comrade/them] - 2.3yr
Steve lacy is so hot.
Bi people are so hot
7
Orannis62 [ze/hir] - 2.3yr
Starting to get a bit worried about my hrt.
I had an AWFUL winter for a lot of reasons, it wasn't solely down to my hormones. But my hormones were def a contributing factor. I was taking injections and my estradiol levels were way too high and I always felt like shit. But I also felt like I couldn't lower the dose because then it always ran out before the end of the week, and taking more frequently always caused my levels to skyrocket even when I adjusted the dosage to compensate.
I'm taking estradiol by pill now and it's way way better, I feel good. But I'm not going back on spiro for a number of reasons, and I'm beginning to suspect my T levels are rising because I get morning wood occasionally. I know you can't really do estrogen monotherapy with pills, and I'm worried about my T levels, but I'm also feeling so good rn that I'm not sure I want to change anything.
7
lapis [fae/faer, comrade/them] - 2.3yr
I did (semi-)sublingual E monotherapy for a year and a half, so it's certainly possible, but I think that may depend heavily on your body's specific reactions to different hormones, sadly.
2
milistanaccount09 [she/her] - 2.3yr
i want bigger boobs but i do not yet have the strength to do what i need to do
::: spoiler spoiler
take prog rectally
:::
7
SnowySkyes - 2.3yr
Is it really that different from taking it orally?
5
milistanaccount09 [she/her] - 2.3yr
It was entirely ineffective for me taken orally, and that's what everyone I know says that's how it is for everyone. Apparently you van do kg sublingually but it tastes awful
6
SnowySkyes - 2.3yr
Hmmm, might have to switch types then. Thanks for the information.
5
queermunist she/her - 2.3yr
It doesn't taste that bad!
5
milistanaccount09 [she/her] - 2.3yr
perhaps i will try then...
5
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
never was into the idea of painting my nails but maybe it would get me to stop biting them all the damn time
7
EllenKelly [comrade/them] - 2.3yr
I think it helped me the first time I painted them, but honestly I chip nail polish so fast they're kinda eff'd up after one day
it does make it a lot nicer to see my hands, would recommend :3
6
khizuo [ze/zir] - 2.3yr
I'm literally in the process of picking at my nails while scrolling the mega.
6
RedQuestionAsker2 [he/him, she/her] - 2.3yr
Literally like my favorite part of presenting femme
4
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
I posted the Unjust Depths content warning in the lib queer discord & talked abt it a lil cause I havent seen it. I am reviewing early chapters for reference. The queer lib discord does not want me talking about murder queers which is deeply disappointing tbh, I would go off about Hunter III's eating habits in there all day. Stan a smol gay texan murder salamander! I have a lot of fun posting about stuff like that and weirding people out tbh.
Uh I legit forgot that the very first chapter is from Erich von Fueller's perspective... why? He is gonna disappear for like the vast majority of the next nine episodes, how long of a game are we setting up here?
6
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler Unjust Depths 9.4 except I got owned by GunslingerSky's superior free time and reading speed. How could this happen!!! The volume of Unjust Depths posting seems to be increasing dramatically though, which is rad.
Aaliyah is so fucking hardcore about Sieglinde, it's great. Ulyana is maybe understandably a lot more sympathetic to her, but Aaliyah is rightly all SHE KILLED OUR COMRADES IN THE REVOLUTION, SHE SHOULD BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE
I first saw the Restorative Justice concept discussed in The Last Girl Scout, and it's still really refreshing to me. Like IMO, if Aaliyah or Khajida just straight up slit her throat, it would be brutal and kind of pointless, indeed it wouldn't serve justice as Aaliyah says, but I'd find it kind of hard to blame them. But no, instead our hard-assed commie captain and commissar happily hear her out. So much for bloodthirsty tankies...
It's a great moment for Sieglinde too, it's hard not to be sympathetic to her. I mean she wasn't literally as child soldier but she was basically groomed for combat, under threat of not being accepted by her adopted family. She's also a little more based than I had expected, describing the leadership as "greedy Imperial landlords", lol.
Sieglinde needs a hug, big time...
Also CAPTAIN ULYANA IS ON HER WAY INTO UN-FUMBLE TOWN It's so adorable & funny when Aaliyah folds her ears and her tail shakes a bit, like dawwwwww you fucking dorky cat! She has a soft center actually, and Ulyana absolutely must be getting close to repairing things.
However, it had a nice boozy bite to it, and it would certainly fuck her up.
And getting fucked up was all she wanted in that moment, inshallah.
KHAJIDA ❤ and then immediately KHAJIDA OH NO, now I feel bad for Sieglinde, rip. Not like it's unexpected though...
:::
6
JohannaChittarra - 2.3yr
I love how these threads are growing bigger every week. Our posting is getting so powerful.
6
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler Spoiler-free Unjust Depths chicanery
So I was thinkin really hard, mostly because every Diver pilot comes out of their machine covered in sweat and exhausted I suppose...
All of the enlisted soldiers onboard the Brigand must be incredibly fit, right? And maybe the sailors too? Like, DYEL-tier, muscular & athletic, surely. Idk how much mechanical resistance is or isn't involved in diver piloting, but like certainly right? In general? Just a secret cruiser full of incredibly strong women?
There's not a lot of descriptions of people's physicalities iirc, so Idk, maybe not. Sonya Shalikova is meant to be pretty slim, so maybe Diver piloting isn't that physically strenuous? But I'm kinda surprised that Depths hasn't leaned on "hot stronk women" thing at all, to my memory. Could always do it, y'knowwww...
Tbh the Buff Transbian is one of my favourite archetypes and rarely seen, so y'know!
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6
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler Massive, nearly play-by-play analysis of Unjust Depths 9.5 - click for autistic transgender homosexuality!!
9.5: MAJIDA MENTIONED!!!!! Twice even! But this is The Relationships Chapter, for everybody.
Shalikova continues to be adorable in her nervous affection for Cuttlefish Lady. "Purple marshmallow"!!!!
It's a cool scene when she walks in to Maryam travelling in the aether, it really feels like her understanding of Maryam has increased considerably.
Whatever it was that she was doing, Shalikova wanted to support her.
I love Sonya Shalikova so much. She could overtake Murati in my favourites. This scene is fucking adorable ugh I could keysmash about it. Nowt but love in my heart for them, the way Madiha writes their awkward new love makes me feel. Oh my god they're so cute help????? Like their bit is that Maryam is the overly enthusiastic sunshiney one and Shalikova is the overly serious stiff and awkward one, but they're so cute at eachother that the dynamic feels perfectly balanced between them.
I'm your idiot now, Maryam.
Shalikova's narration of psionics also feels deeply textural in a way that says "the tism!" very loudly to me. Feels like more of a sensory thing for her, which is rad. Her stream of consciousness is full of flavour like that. I also like that Maryam observes that she feels "dominant and strong, like a Warlord", that's 'strong personality' right? My read is that Sonya's neurotype informs her entire experience of love and affection, and I adore that. There are dedicated romance novels with autistic leads that don't hit the mark as precisely as this.
HAHA, oh man de la Rosa talking about how she always strikes gold with freely available independent fiction, it might seem self-congratulatory if it weren't 100% true. I think I've said what she narrates about it 100% verbatim before.
de la Rosa feels like a self insert for my stupid ass, like Hello ma'am I am also hopelessly obsessed with gay women in my books. I am being reached out to by the author. I really like this, her little summary of Blind Princess and the Kind Retainer reads sort of like what I'm writing right now... There are multiple levels of meta at play, lol.
"Why- why are you freaking out so much. We're both girls, you can stop hiding."
Even Alex realised immediately what a stupid thing to say that was.
Lol, lmao! It's fun to see Handsome Gamer Genivov being nervous and awkward when she's usually so boisterous and loud. I like how when reading Unjust Depths, it pays not to judge a gay by their cover - characters will make weird or even bad impressions at first, and then unfurl amazingly, become fascinating and multi-faceted. Video games are reactionary and cringe, but it's nice to see de la Rosa tolerate Genivov's hobby :)
Handily contrasting how Shalikova sees psionics as an absolute win, meanwhile, Murati is all freaked out about the inequality of being able to read Karuniya's feelings when Karu cannot do the same. Dw Murati it's okay, Karu is a fucking weirdo so it all evens out. At this point "evil ingenuity" is rubbing me really wrongly coming from Karuniya, a fucking weirdo, should not be mischevious. "Hubby" is a straggot term, Karuniya, shut the fuck up.
For what it's worth, it is a decentish scene for the pair of them, and I don't intend to constantly belabour the fact of my boundless disdain for Karuniya. It is at least cool to see Murati show some sexual initiative, I realise now that one of the reasons their relationship can feel so creepy and unbalanced--especially in that 8.13 flashback--is that it's been Karuniya doing almost all of the horny perving, with Murati being mostly passive, which makes her feel weirdly objectified to me. This is at least a slight improvement to the status quo.
The way Zachikova and Arbitrator I are described as cuddling does not, as the narration says, seem out of character for me. It's a very casual, parallel-play type of physical affection, I know it and I like it. Autism. To be honest, Abritrator wrapping her body around Zachikova and sniffing at her hair while she's using a terminal, it reminds me of cuddling my wife sometimes. I adore that Zachikova feels comfortable enough around Madame Fishy, and that this level of comfort is new to her. Affection in general is new to Braya Zachikova, and she seems to have poor emotional regulation about it but isn't distressed by it, which is very cute.
...and then Zachikova says she's all-ready to kill Arbitrator I in a multitude of ways! Countermeasures because she's unfamiliar with cohabiting!! This is weird even to me, but it's funny and befitting of our favourite former spec-ops robotic lady. She is so blunt, they have a curious but deeply pleasant dynamic. This is the best fucking autism rep this side of The Outside by Ada Hoffmann, and the single best chapter of Unjust Depths thus far.
Relatedly, Arbitrator revealing herself to be a sexy(??) yet meek vampire fish is weirdly intimate. I feel weirdly sympathetic to Arbitrator's struggle not to harm humans despite her bloodlust, which is probably me and my murder-gays-affection speaking again. Arbitrator is all fucked up and borderline ashamed about it though, and I think extremely highly of Zachikova for calmly considering Arbitrator's problem without freaking out, she's so good to her fishy gf. I'm uh glad Zachikova can get off to it, there's so much going on in this one scene. Great stuff.
There are some scraps, too:
Ulyana in fact IS on her way to un-fumbling; she and Aaliyah are having more than one shot, in their night clothes, toasting to the proletarian revolution! Progress!! Mostly they talk about the progress of the Brigand's mission and its truly wonderful crew, but I liked Aaliyah drunkenly nuzzling Ulyana's hand, very cute.
ELENA IS READING THEORY NO FUCKING WAY, on her way to becoming a bonafide Mordecist!!! And telling Marina about it!!!!! It's great seeing Marina acknowledge that she hadn't been considering Elena's feelings, and Elena apologising for trying to hurt Marina. They'll get better together, as friends!
Euphrates and Tigris mostly bicker about current events and get a little inspired to resolve the Sunlight Foundation's internal contradictions, thanks to Murati. They are cute together at least, and it's nice to know Tigris took in Euphrates' blood to become immortal.
Haaaaaaaaaaha oh man, Sonya being so awkward asking Murati for advice is noooot stemming my nascent filthy rotten shipping instincts! They WILL kiss!!! Read eachothers', auras, homos, and play coy!!!! Avoid eachothers' clear affections
Is it kind of a pacing mishap to have ALL OF THESE relationship updates piled into one chapter? Maybe, but it's a good come-down after Goryk's Gorge, the ascent and all of the interrogations, plus it pulled my heartstrings a bunch of times. I was reading Into the Drowning Deep by Mira Grant (a messy but enjoyable shlock-horror novel) when I theorised: if you add queers, transes, autists, and other identities I have to your genre fiction's protagonists, it will greatly improve my investment in everything else, right up to action sequences. Unjust Depths is the absolute poster child for this though, the quality relationships are the bedrock for everything else, the political maneuvering and mecha action and deep-sea esoterics.
Addendum:
In plot movement terms, at the end we finally get Carthus, once again, Erich's pet evil twink. My excitement knows no bounds, his dramatic expressions of being the mercury to Erich's sun, is this what yaoi is usually like? If you keep me on a steady dose of lesbians alongside it, I could get used to this too. Sing to your prince, racist pretty boy~!
I adore what an irredeemable little fuck Carthus is, ooh he's SUCH an evil murder twink. Nice to see that Erich has access to Sunlight's EDEN database too, and his bag is that the Sunlight Foundation basically allowed Emperor Nocht I to erase history and build this shitty empire with all its troubles. He wants to rewrite history and the empire in his own image. A united One World Government, beginning with the destruction of the summer palace. He is playing an EXCEEDINGLY long game.
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5
RedQuestionAsker2 [he/him, she/her] - 2.3yr
Me waiting for the next trans mega
5
Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her] - 2.3yr
oh god i can feel myself becoming the basic ass trans girl with a praise kink in real time
5
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler Y'all tired of these Unjust Depths postings yet? 9.3 discussion.
Not much to say about 9.3, kind of a slight chapter. I adore how Khajida feels equally:
Deeply disappointed/anticlimaxed that her rival, the Red Baron, is just a pathetic, sad, lacking, exhausted dumb bitch who sucks, and won't give her the satisfying victory of killing her
Gutted to see that Sieglinde is very much like her: middle aged and feeling the passage of time, slowing down, borderline sympathetic, and totally understandable
Hateful that Sieglinde is sad and self-pitying and feeling remorse after causing so much suffering and fighting for horrendous causes, killing her comrades
It's such a complicated tangle of emotions, it's kind of a huge mess after that lifelong rivarly. Hearing Khajida silently goad Sieglinde to do something about what a heartless, evil person she's been, it's great. But also though HOW DARE U KHAJIDA 42 YEARS IS NOT "OLD" >:|
The interrogations with Marina and Arbitrator are all absolutely hilarious though. When Ulyana asks why Marina wasn't honest about Elena being royalty, she yaps:
"You're fucking communists! one of your things is 'eat the rich' isn't it?"
You see Marina, The Romanovs Deserved it, we have a brick wall and some rifles down in the brig,
I was less pleased when Ulyana asked about uh, Elena's parentage. ULYANA!!! DO NOT FUCKING REFER TO HER AS A "FATHER" I am so pleased that Aaliyah glares at her for this, good stuff. Beloved commissar.
Afterword we get Zachikova and Arbitrator I at the desk, and when Arbitrator describes the bomb collar Zachikova put on her as "a form of play", and declares her intent to breed with Zachikova, I lost it. Zachikova is furious and deeply flustered throughout the whole thing, so Arbitrator will call her "master" and Zachikova will threaten to blow her fucking head off, and then Aaliyah goes "This is an interrogation not some raunchy kink thread on a BBS!" I love her, ngl.
I am glad that Ulyana is asking the same what-are-her-motives questions I am about Arbitrator tho, and fwiw it does seem like Abritrator is just kinda vibing, like she probably actually just wants to kiss Zachikova a bunch?
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5
Cromalin [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler i will never be tired of unjust depths discussion
khadija's whole mess of feelings around sieglinde is so good. love her so much. any time 2 old rivals are in a scenario like that i cheer, and the ideological angle just makes it even better. the drama! sieglinde is so sad about everything and i'm sympathetic but also like "hey! you did very much kill a lot of people for an evil empire!" it rules
marina is so funny. ulyana shouldn't have made the comment but like, i'm not that unsympathetic to someone not thinking it through when talking about who provided sperm? it feels like one of those things where the language is complex and i'm not really gonna judge after she apologizes, you know? thank god for aaliyah tho, yeah
zachikova and arbitrator i are so funny!!! i love them so much, this whole scene rules. aaliyah just saying the quiet part out loud, it's really good. ulyana asking the correct questions, arbitrator is vibing and clearly has goals outside of kissing zachikova (and a history with the other omenseers) but that's the most important one, and enough to probably trust her
2
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler SUPERB, NOR SHALL I
Top shelf indeed, I guess Sienglinde is like Gertrude if she weren't Garbage von Lichtenberg So she's pathetic in a sympathetic way which makes it nail-biting and thrilling to watch them both be furious about eachothers' pasts until they kiss. Tbh by this point I wasn't expecting anybody over 40 to get paired off so uncritical support, I am overjoyed ✨
I don't hold it against Ulyana no, I did for a split second wonder if something beautiful had happened and Elena was the lovechild of Marina and Leda, that might have been kinda funny actually. It's a very slight mark against the "normalisation" argument for Karuniya I think, because certainly a society where trans people are completely normalised would have eradicated cisnormative language? But Ulyana is probably (maybe) (presumably?) (can we please have a 30+ hot trans lady somewhere on this boat, Ya Allah PLEASE) just a cis nerd and it's a great little moment for everyone's favourite covert intelligence cat and her dorky captain.
Yes yes! To me Abritrator I seemed really sus when she showed up in the hangar and started being filthy, but I suppose it is simply a cultural difference between psionic fishy lesbians and monotone robot lesbians I am glad we can more or less trust her, the folkloric aspect of the Omerseers' plot shenanigans is a superb new flavour for the series, and also tells us that in this setting everyone, even the eldritch sea creatures, has been gay for at least a millenium
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3
Cromalin [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler love to hear it
yeah exactly! exactly! khadija is great, love that she's getting her enemies to lovers story in her middle age. she deserves it. and sieglinde deserves a chance to try and redeem herself, and also get her OWN enemies to lovers story! love these middle aged women getting a chance to shine!
hadn't elena already been born when marina first met leda? but what a beautiful thing to imagine, why not have hope? also in general idk what the correct way to refer to a trans woman as 'the one whose sperm led to the child' is, though obviously father is cisnormative and not correct. and ulyana and aaliyah are great, 100%
she can be gay and way too forward, as a treat. i do love all the omenseer lore, extremely fun
2
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler I have 0 social energy like 90 percent of the time but my stamina for discussing Unjust Depths is endless basically
She is and yeah same, again the intergenerational vibes come through strong and wonderful. I desire to see her hang out with the young'uns due to this, every time she says about "the new generation of warriors meant to take her place" and shit. We love to see it!!!
Yes I think she had but counterpoint: I forgor :) the idea that Konstantin was fuming and buttmad because he got cucked by a transbian covert agent is so fucking rad, y'know? Would also explain why Erich seems to disdain Elana, uh okay new headcanon! I'm not sure either, I was kinda hoping Unjust Depths would tell me :)
Omenseers deserve little treats!!! I like how there is one aphotic sea horror per plot-relevant ship currently, this is going really well & the Brigand's crew just expanded in very fascinating ways.
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3
Cromalin [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler hell yeah me too
yeah! i wanna see more scenes like the one where she mentored shalikova! lots of potential, she's not in my top 5 characters but is one i always love to see more of
hmmm yeah. i agree, it's much more fun to imagine this and marina just not believing it to be true. and yeah idk. if the union hasn't figured it out i really have no idea what one might blurt out when theorizing there
yeah it's fun! the brigand keeps taking on new passengers it didn't really mean to, but it's great to see. i hope they end up needing to somehow build more rooms to house all the people they pick up
2
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler Love to see it!!
I think broadly as well, I just wanna see more inter-crew interaction on the Brigand, such a fascinating collection of gays to chat!!! Aw don't make me choose a top 5 characters though, I will not choose a favourite child
Yep you cannot remove my headcanon, Marina is just a chad and can't handle it beloved. There has to be an answer to this but Idk either yaw.
SHIP MAINTENANCE AND EXPANSION, BRIGAND GETS A NEW DECK The blueprint originally had a third floor, so it's actually plausible that they could add a Dedicated Gay Housing level.
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3
Cromalin [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler you do indeed love to see it
absolutely! wanna see more interpersonal interactions forever, but it's probably for the best the plot keeps moving. i wasn't gonna, but since you brought it up who are your top 5? don't need to be in order
misread as Dedicated Guy Housing and was like "well i would describe some of these characters as funny little guys (maryam mostly, but i could be convinced of arabella) but i don't think any of them are guys"
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2
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler Head Full, Many Thought: Unjust Depths 9.1-9.2
Sonya Shalikova kissed her cuttlefish lady finally, and it was adorable. I relate strongly to her acting alienated about the ways people date and have sex, very cool. She could do it for Maryam!!!!
Conversely Dear Zachikova, the fish lady with the gore robe emerging from a pile of fleshy briney guts is NOT AT ALL SUS, she is NOT MIND CONTROLLING YOU and you should DEFINITELY FUCK HER lmao.
I do like how blunt Zachikova's narration is about her attractions and lack thereof. She is extremely, deeply unconcerned about fucking the newly-formed fish lady. Took a lot of restraint not to fuck her on the floor of the hangar though, I never had Zachikova pegged for "too horny to live, will be subsumed by a sexy sea creature"... uncritical support though, lol. I like Arbitrator I and her aid in the ascent of the Brigand is extremely cool, the whole Omenseers thing fucks really hard.
During that same ascent, Yana finally gets over her hangups with EMOTIONAL SUPPORT CATGIRL AALIYAH, WHO GETS YOU THROUGH SUDDEN ASCENT! Everything from the point Ulyana realises that Arbitrator I is the dancer fish to the point where she calls for damage assessment is rad.
Meanwhile onboard the Antenora, I really did expect Norn to just beat the absolute living shit out of Gertrude, repeatedly, viciously. I woulda critically supported her, even! But the way she sees Emperor Konstantin in Gertrude, how she feels like a failure of a mentor, how she grants forgiveness to her, and the way she considers all of this as she stares at her own clenched fist while time is stopped? Again it's a stellar moment for her. Norn always seems like she's just rampaging around manipulating and murdering motherfuckers to take her bottomless anger out, but there's so much going on with her internally. Her complicated feelings about the Emperor, her shrouded mysterious past with the Sunlight Foundation, her bond with Adelheid. She is an absolutely fucking superb villian. If evil lady bad, why sympathetic and complex and fascinating??? I cannot fathom her motivations and I desperately want to know.
Out of the Loser Gang, Selene sees the most immediate change, having been schooled by some funny gay autist.
Selene was speechless. Not just at the doctor's manic behaviour, but at her own foolishness.
She had pumped a lot of psynadium during her confrontation with that girl-
Sonya Shalikova.
To think she had ti go this far to try to outmatch her and even so-
And as a result Sonya has a rival now, finally!! Selene deserves to feel like a pathetic untermensch or whatever the fuck, what a nerd lol. What credibility did she have?
But aside from ubermensch here getting dunked on, I learned a lot about her inner workings. When Selene asks questions about Who She Is, Why She Was Born, What She Is Meant For, I realise finally that she has fundamentally misunderstood the concept of purpose in life.
She asserts that natal humans are born with innate destinies, in families, states, ethnicities and such. She asserts that even Katarrans have a born purpose, but that she has nothing as a blank-slate person, and asks how to attain a destiny if not born with it. She is so myopically focused on PURPOSE that she cannot envision making her own. A character flaw of sorts. She desperately wants to be told her purpose, and knows not what she would do with herself if given freedom. Norn, who lives in spite of her grand stated purposes, strikes a fascinating contrast.
I'll be real, chat, Unjust Depths is really picking up. Its leads are gaining in complexity and the pacing is tighter than a guitar string. Already good and only keeps getting better.
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4
Cromalin [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler hell yeah
shalikova is getting her girl! love them so much. arbitrator i is like the opposite of sus, would you not immediately trust a beautiful girl who popped out of the flesh of a monster you pulled in from the sea? i love zachikova's weird relationship with her, it's very funny. and yeah! ulyana is making progress!
this is such a good moment for norn. like, yeah! she's about to beat the shit out of gertrude, but i think what she actually does might have hurt gertrude worse. gertrude is SO pathetic, it's astounding. there's a really fantastic piece of art of gertrude at this point in the story and she looks wretched. just completely broken. if i can find it i'll show you
and yeah, selene is really kinda fascinating. just a completely alien way of viewing the world to me, but it's also really sad. she's a little weirdo and i'm kinda rooting for her? not like, to win in fights, but to figure out her place in the world. and yeah she makes a good rival!
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3
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler HELL YEAH
Much love for the various bits of relationship progress this chapter. Also uh Idk, uncritical support but given that she's from the same line of Omenseers as the one that's currently piloting the world-ending Dagon fleshboat, uh I dunno yaknow =) "I arose from the primordial sea, I have psionic ability beyond your ken, have sex with me funny robot lady!" I do like that Zachikova is sort of getting 'awakened' in relationship terms by her, and I do like fish lady, but I don't really trust her motives. I'm with Yana on this one, a positive force for now but highly suspect...
It's incredible, and the mental breakdown Gertrude has in the brig afterword is even sadder. "Hours must have turned into days into weeks", but nah 14 hours, you are just weak willed, inquisitor. She has reached roughly the right conclusion through completely wrong means: Yes, your career was built on blood and guts just to get gf. Yes, you have no commitment and no ideology without gf. Yes, it is roughly the edifice of Empire and its stratified social castes which kept you from gf. So now she is going to murder every ruler in the empire, which lol. At least her uncomprehending fury is pointing in vaguely the right direction? But she IS wretched. I do not approve of her using a rebound-puppy! Ingrid is equally as pathetic but I feel really bad for her!!!
I dunno what it would take for Selene to quit being weird and sad, her worldview is so broken and warped. Theoretically Norn is one of the healthier people she could have as a mentor, but her brainworms are extremely terminal Idk. I still don't understand why she desires to be ORDAINED A DESTINY BY DIVINE RIGHT or whatever, it almost feels like I'm missing context for her that I should have...
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4
Cromalin [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler all the relationship stuff is great!
yeah lmao. arabella is not exactly putting the most trustworthy foot forward! but i still love everything with her and zachikova, even if it's definitely wise to keep an eye on her. on the other hand if zachikova is enjoying herself who are we to judge!
absolutely. gertrude is maybe the biggest failgirl in the story. hopefully she kills a lot of rulers though, that'd be fun! and yeah she's so awful to ingrid, you can't play with her feelings like that! also i found the fanart! look at this wretched creature
yeah idk what it would take, probably being captured by the brigand? but that seems unlikely at this stage
also i started rereading 9 to double check when shit happened and make sure i wasn't referencing future things and i got sucked in and am halfway through the second intermission now
3
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler All submarines should have this much lesbianism!!
It's not that I think she's evil or whatever, like Hunter III is good people, Omenseers can be good people. I guess she's only really A) saved the Brigand from agarthic death B) tried to... uh it's the overly-enthusiastic sexual advances that give me pause, I guess. Zachikova seems sort of mixed, like she clearly wants to know more before they bang in public, and yes me too!! I am curious to see them talk, & stuff. I also assume Arabella has a bigger motive for getting onboard the Brigand than just loving Zachikova, like she's at war with other Omenseers or something, but I could be wrong?
Tbh, if she just turns her rage around and crashes the Iron Lady into the Fueller castle, or obliterates the Volkische or whatever, that's the best action for her now. Ingrid deserves better :( Also lol nice, yeah that's about correct. #1 failgirl ✨
Idk if that would even help, like Selene is so actually deranged it's not funny. Wants to be needed by Norn...
Yeeeeeah :D it's engrossing, I read it in huge chunks whenever I'm goofing off at work.
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4
Cromalin [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler joining a submarine crew and getting mad it isn't like unjust depths and i don't get a meet-cute with a lesbian disguised as a nun
oh yeah i absolutely get you. zachikova is definitely at least a little too confused to be completely on board at this stage. we do get into her more very soon!
yeah that'd be ideal probably. though not ideal for ME because i want to see the drama when her and elena run into each other again! i want gertrude to feel even worse and elena to try and fix her!
yeah... i feel bad tho... i wanna see her happy!
yeah i read the whole 2nd intermission (really good! super interesting stuff that's kinda similar to the first one but also i like it way more) and have started episode 10 lmao. it's really engrossing, that's definitely the right word. i have been reading it while i should be doing other things
2
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler It would be killer recruitment material for a navy, you cannot deny...
Looking forward to getting into spooky fish lady more very soon!!!
Okay c'mon you are brutal, you wouldn't really wish that upon our freshly communised princess would you? Elena so does not deserve to be saddled with the task of trying to fix Actual Human Trainwreck Gertrude. It might be funny, it might also be very sad, hmmmm...
I do not have enough investment in Selene personally to want to see her happy, Idrk who she even is or where she came from. Did I skip a chapter?
Nice, pacing aside I liked Intermission 1, I'm hoping the squeakwuel gives us updates on characters who have long since vacated the plot: Yangtze, Victoria Van Veka, Sawyer, the anarchists and the Khaybar Pass shimii, Erich. I desire to see them again!!!
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3
Cromalin [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler if i could join the union navy i would
well i would feel very bad for her but i think she would like to try and have that closure and also still loves gertrude despite everything. and also it would be very juicy and sad. oh shit a new piece of unjust depths fanart relevant to this just dropped today (gertrude and elena)
she's just part of norn's crew, i don't think you missed anything. idk i'm a sucker for this kind of sad girl who sucks like that
::: spoiler incredibly vague intermission 2 structure spoilers
it's more structured than the first in a way i like, but there's still a bunch of that broader scope world stuff, as well as some new bits that are very fun
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2
Cromalin [she/her] - 2.3yr
Break yourself inside out, she told me
We know deep down there's no way
Even if I smash the mirror
How do we look?
Not cute
Oh, lullaby
Don't stop until I fall in flames
Stay with, stay with me until the end of time
So carry on, love the subhuman self
Time goes on, lasting road
I left my regret
So carry on, love the subhuman self
Time goes on, lasting road
I feel a touch of moonlight
is almost as trans as bridget's theme
4
vertexarray [any] - 2.3yr
tekken 8 looks kind of busted, sajam seems to be getting shitty connections and 1 and done matchups all the time. shoutout to alpacas tho
3
ashinadash [she/her] - 2.3yr
::: spoiler Relitigating my stupid takes on Unjust Depths 13.8 that suck
We should all benefit from my extensive pain & suffering today, because despite everything I did manage to improve my understanding somewhat. Consider this a follow up to my welcome to hell, 8.13) post.
First off, my assumption about Karuniya's "thing" being neurotypical woo-woo was absolutely completely accurate. This I simply know to be the case, because if you ask neurotypicals (or even anybody neurodiverse, usually) about this type of thing, they'll just wave their fingers mysteriously and be confused about why you do not 'get' & adore it. They'll act like it is simply known, so no luck there. Makes sense, I think the entire flashback is really underwritten; long passages of dialogue go unaccompanied by any real descriptive narration or anything beyond Karuniya's running commentary. I don't think it gives the reader a sense of the affection between them, which as an autist makes perfect sense, 'pls be more obvious' y'know.
The revelation that I hadn't considered, because it does not enter my mind, because wtf, is something most readers probably find really obvious: ✨ It's a butch/femme bit ✨ ! And I was like ohhhhhhh, a lightbulb powered on in my brain, this makes perfect sense! Karuniya isn't a creep because she's necessarily a weird fetishist, she's a creep because the bit they're doing is a literal husband-and-wife bit!!! Although you do have to wonder, on their first date, has Murati agreed to play The Man in this relationship? Was it discussed, does it count as consenting if they woo-woo vibes make eyes at eachother neurotypically? It sort of seems like Karuniya has constructed a "Murati" in her brain before they even date.
Vibes-based analysis, I see two sorts of contexts, ish, in which butch/femme appears as a 'thing'. One is mostly as an aesthetic or stylistic choice for the people involved, and not a lot more than that? The other one I tend to associate with like, old 1970s bar culture, and has both of them be almost gender identities unto themselves, with the butch basically being a 1:1 comedy trad man replacement. A thing! (Please bully me over this weird and probably wrong read, I do not pride myself on social understanding)
It's pretty efficient as an explanation, because whenever I've read queer fic that plays into this really specific gendery butch/femme, I have been almost as weirded out by those too. Personally I never got why you'd want to replicate stock-standard heterosexual RETVRN gender roles with women... but I tend not to worry about it. If cis women wanna do that, sure, power to you. Hell, if trans people wanna, of course, who the fuck am I to say no?
The problem I have with 8.13 is many compounding things: as I nudged above, it kind of seems like this whole idea only comes from Karuniya's end, like it's wholly her thing and she pushes it onto Murati. In the flashback I feel like I can read Murati's reaction to it as anything from "slightly bemused" to "really awkward", and she seems more confused than anything when Karuniya starts calling her "husband" way back. Recently, as in circa 9.x, Karuniya has taken to calling her "hubby" and does Murati ever respond to it??? The time when Murati observes that Karuniya is "a screamer" in 9.5 is literally the first time I can remember that Murati has expressed, really romantic or sexual attraction, not just to her fiance but to ANYBODY. She's so passive and quiet about it, even in her inner thoughts, and Karuniya's enthusiastic prattling seems weird by contrast. I had kind of hoped 8.13 was gonna show us that Yes, Murati wants it too! but only barely. The romantically inexpressive, surprisingly unreactive Murati is a poor match for Karuniya's over-enthused neurotypical hypersexuality.
The truth is though, it doesn't really cover for Karuniya being desperately cock-hungry all the time. I don't need to belabour that point though, because frankly pretty much everything I said in that post still holds up. Karuniya seems flippant and uninterested in anything about Murati that doesn't involve sex. Do they ever talk about anything else? Surely Karuniya should be asking Murati how her squad leadership is going, right, since it's new for her? I know so much more about the link between Sonya and Maryam, or Norn and Adelheid, than I do the protagonist and her fiance.
I think Murati/Karuniya is an underwritten mess, lacking a lot of the small, telling details you would usually see in a good romance, or even several of the relationships in Unjust Depths!! It's an ugly mix and I hate it, I really wish I could not think this, but there is soooooo much at play here.
As an addendum: I find it interesting that Murati/Karuniya as a pair is so steeped in a real-world parsing of gender between sapphics. Most of the relationships in UD range anywhere from "somewhat removed from our social context" (autistic mech pilot x psionic cuttlefish churchlady) to "waaaay removed from our social context", (autistic robot lady x bloodsucking shifter fish woman from the depths) I do really like that the author is so enamoured with fish, it's cute and fun. But I'm not primed to expect what is bssically a sapphic romance trope, to me it sticks out like a sore thumb.
:::
SnowySkyes in traaaaaaannnnnnnnnns
Trans Megathread for the Week of 4/8 - 4/14
I hope everyone had a great week! Hang out. Chat. Talk about what's going on. Have fun :3
Posting from my hospital room this week. Hope everyone is doing well.
::: spoiler CW: Talking about bottom surgery and some other icky things This week has been such a fantastic one for me. I got my bottom surgery done last Friday and I’m still in the hospital recovering from it. It has done an astronomical amount of good for me already and I still haven’t seen it. I am calmer. I feel as through the weight of the world has been lifted off my shoulders. I feel at peace for the first time in…ever I think. Like, I have been able to just sit here and pass out for no reason whatsoever. For most that sounds whatever, but I have never been able to do that. I’m smiling huge and wide and nothing can bring this girl down. I feel AMAZING!!!
That said, there have been things I wasn’t expecting. Like for one, it feels like my scrotum has been scrunched, stretched out, and lain over a canvas. My dickhead feels like it’s being crushed and in 3 different places. And at times, if eels like my entire old package was collapsed into a singularity. It’s so weird. I just need to remind myself that they don’t exist anymore. :)
Gods. What a fucking week.
:::
hopefully it doesnt hurt too much. DRUGS
-explaining to a gamer-
Okay, you know how sometimes you start a game, and you have to pick a build, but nobody really tells you anything about it, so you just pick the one that is recommended and looks easy? But after some time, you realize that you aren't having fun with that build, but people around are used to you playing that build? You want to respec, but respeccing costs money, and once you respec, there's gonna be a long period of you being really bad at playing your new build?. It's like that.
Been trying voice training, and I showed my wife my femme voice, and she, very supportively said, "it sounds really good. You sound like contrapoints :)))"
🤮 🤮 🤮
segue into becoming a valley girl just to not sound like contra
a finger on the monkeys paw closes
I, like, totally, couldn't handle that!
Gay for girls! I never understood why I couldn't get things with women to feel right before!
yeah, like, "why can't i find a gf???" it's because you keep trying to date straight girls lol
I adore how much your own gender impacts your attraction, when you alter your own self it makes a huge difference to how you relate to & kiss other people. I fuckin love being a lesbian.
yeah, I remember having the
HIGHLY CISGENDER THOUGHT
of being lowkey jealous of lesbians because deep down i knew sexual/romantic attraction hit different depending on where it came from and that as a cis guy i would just never be able to experience that
Cis men really are missing out. They should transition so they can be women-loving-women as well.
My phase where I decided I was just gonna write on a notepad instead of speaking, before I quit giving a fuck
punching shit into my spell and speak
"EFF! YOU! CEE! KAY! TEE! EEE! ARE! EFF! ESS!"
i feel like the easiest way to pass is to simply have long hair
I got bullied out of having long hair in high school.
But nobody can stop me now.
Can confirm, which kinda sucks because having cool.short dykey hair should not preclude you being gendered correctly. But people assume, no goofyass MAN would keep such an incredible wavy butt-length waterfall in such amazing condition ✨
It's pretty funny. All these transphobe are like "I can always tell" and then as soon as you grow your hair out 6 inches doing nothing else, they act like you're Snake under a cardboard box
Forced feminisation, but instead of just being a kink you are on a mission to awaken all transfemmes to their identities :)
DBZ scouter but it shows egg levels.
Extended They Live fight scene where the eggs refuse to put the scouter on
down with cis
Still recovering. Will be going home later today, but I still have trapped gas in my shoulders causing me severe pain when I need to move. Also developed some nausea over the past 24 hours. Feeling generally unwell. Not sure if normal or something I should alert someone about.
Since you're not sure, try to talk with someone, rather talk too much than too little.
I managed to earlier. Apparently it’s fairly common for a while post-op, so I’m going to continue as normal for the time being.
can confirm, it shouldnt go on for too long but yeah your body is recovering - used to have to take anti-nausea tablets for a few weeks after
also happy to answer any other questions around being post-op if you did have any! i'm about 5 years post
also congrats, glad things went well by the sounds of it !! 
Great.
Damn that last mega really was poppin' off, love to see it ❤
The gang's all here
oh hey, more shit that's gender envy now :)
gotta get those numbers up
I’ve made so many stenciled cloth patches recently and here are some I thought the mega might enjoy
do you have a source for the art for that hammer + sickle + gender symbols? that thing is fuckin' incredible.
the original source seems to be this
on a side note, i realized after i had sent the images that the bottom photo accidentally got flipped sideways, lol
this is so cool, thanks for sharing!
These are so good!
Hexbear is alive
about a week before i was able to come out to myself as trans my dear trans femme friend sent me this poem to look over. i remember being moved by the second paragraph, but i couldn't make any sense of the third
it all really is too clear now
That last paragraph reminds me when my anxiety had me at my lowest. Literally curled crying on the ground daily. Felt like I completely lost myself and had to reconstruct myself. I was clinging on for dear life. Literally every moment of holding on was a victory. Like the passage, I actually imagined having ropes to hold my mind together.
So glad that's behind me now. Despite the pain I feel now, it pales in comparison to that. Feels like I can face anything now.
Beautiful writing.
Beautiful. I really want to share this to some friends.
Did your dear transfemme friend write this? Good shit.
no, and i don't know who did, but i cab always ask
Oke, ty, just curious cause it's superb
"Balloon on a string" is actually imagery I've thought of before myself
for me it was more like a 100lb weight i strapped to my chest. this burden i just had to bear. I felt light and free when I finally was able to tell myself that I could take it off
Why is my dislike of being a guy getting stronger
This was not supposed to happen
You're being affected by hexbear trans radiation
This is my personal Chernobyl.
trying to figure out your trans when you're bisexual is really weird and hard. like, both are great? i don't want to look like a man, but at the same time, men are really fucking hot??? what gives?
Yes. Also - is it gender envy or sexual attraction: the game.
But yes being bi and trans is very confusing also idk if it's like this for you but like my attraction to men is completely different than my attraction to women. So like how will I choose -.-
The bi-cycle can be a real motherfucker, especially when your tastes are so varied.
Yeah I simultaneously want to be a lwsbian muscle mommy and be made to feel small and fragile by a man. I feel like I exist like in the middle lol
actually the only consistent answer i ever get to this question is "both" and honestly i think that's a great answer
So true it pretty much is mostly both haha. I was watching this totally trash TV show last night called love island, which is basically hot straight people being hot and straight and I think I mostly get envy from the women on there, cause for the most part straight girls aren't that attractive to me (I want their legs though).
Side note: they should make a dating game show like that with all bi people. That would be entertaining af
Genderfluid partner who can do both?
YES
reminder: being a trans woman is cool and awesome
oh my it is good and back to be posting. I don't know if I should post the exact date but like
Did you tell them it was gonna be a hot girl summer?
no, it's actually been unusually cold about here and i we were complaining about that instead
Cold girl spring =)
i always loved winter fashions more anyway :)
Warm cozy cardigans, scarves, incredible winter coats, thigh-high boots. Winter mom fashion is my vibe yes
based
I hope this isn't prying, but what is your appointment for? I was under the impression planned parenthood essentially just did birth control, nothing trans issue related.
Informed consent for HRT? at least they do that here in Placeofresidencysburg
Oh that's cool! I had forgotten. Hope its a quick couple of months for you!
::: spoiler Being crass about orchi Okay so I kind of wanna get my fuckin balls chopped off, so I can tuck easier and so I don't ever need to worry about the encroaching menace of testosterone. But I'm pretty worried it'd interfere with potential future stuff if/when I wanted bottom surgery... :::
mood
I too wish to strike a killing blow against the testosterone demon. But yeah, same worries.
Happy
4/20!oops I mean Eclipse DayI think I have been very dysphoric lately, and it's possibly because I have done very few gender affirming things. I just am too nervous to be perceived.
You know, it's funny. I find my gender dysphoria can actually get really bad if I do too many gender affirming things and then suddenly have to switch back to do something like boymode at work
I'm really sorry you're feeling like that though :(
I now hav an appointment with an hrt person, at a place recommended to me by the local trans community. Hope it will go well.
Connecting with the locals is really important, does not solve everything, but for example I, without them, would have needed several more months till I tried again at a doctors apoointment.
The masculine urge to shave my entire body
There's actually no such thing as being cisgender. Everyone is already trans, and all trans people know it, it's just considered rude to point that fact out since peopleneed to figure that out on their own with only gentle guidance. We're all eggs and Hexbear is on a mission to make the world's biggest omelet.
To be real with some of the replies in the mega plus how many people come in here weekly, I kind of think this halfway unironically
Unfortunately, this is selection bias. People who are cool tend to be more trans than people who suck.
Adventure time giving me so much gender envy lol
Major breast pain the last few days, hoping it's a sign of growth happening.
Just a few weeks into HRT my aerolas got really puffy, and went from being mostly flat to small mounds, but almost nothing else has happened except directly around them yet, and it makes me feel insecure about wearing tighter shirts and stuff.
You will need bras or very very loose and thick shirts soon :) or pasties I guess, lol
I actually asked about this in a previous mega, and people gave me some good options for what I should look at. So far it's been cold enough for multiple layers, but soon there's gonna be t-shirt weather and I don't want to walk around with nipples basically poking through the fabric.
in case you dont know, they should continue to grow for several years as long as your levels are good, even if the pain and tenderness does subside after a while
just some rambling (cw racism)
moved from rural yorkshire to montreal last year
been thinking a lot about yorkshire, i miss it a lot - being surrounded by hills in valleys for 20ish shaped me a lot i think..
for the first few years of my life i essentially lived in a slum in bradford; from as early i can remember my mum told me about how nice bradford was during her childhood and blamed polish and pakistani people for ruining it. of course, she was describing white flight and the intentional destruction of bradford by the state wielding the automobile.
i would say
she would reply to 7 or 8 year old me. what 0 materialism does to a mf!
a couple of years ago i moved to a town in the happy valley with a trans girl from northern ireland i met on 4chan, we'd only met irl once before moving in together (purely platonic). she was a complete lib and i only realised how rude and cruel she'd been to me after i moved out. we were both desperate to get away from our parents. she'd make constant comments about my weight (not that it matters, but I had a normal BMI!) and call me a 0 effort passoid. eventually i cut her off after a fucking episode of the rehearsal of all things. we still lived together for a few weeks and during that time she ruined some of my medication that i had to keep in the fridge. it was the zionist episode and she had some interesting opinions on jews. she justified those opinions to me after i challenged her on them, "everyone on twitter says...."
i feel an overwhelming sense of powerlessness when i think of yorkshire. god's own country, truly. the conditions some people live in there are horrible. as soon as i moved to quebec i could only think how people would react if they knew how high north american living standards are. i miss the market towns (despite being full of pensioners), i miss the cities (despite being full of londoners), i miss the stunning landscape (despite it being continually ravaged). the roman empire was once ruled from york and now it's a glorified tourist attraction. i feel like i lost something i never had https://lemmygrad.ml/pictrs/image/64c818c6-1c2f-4cb9-8b8f-f9fdf90f1f0a.jpeg
I was gonna say "you were lucky 'lib' is as bad as she was given it's 4ch", and then I saw the word "passoid". /tttt/ is a death cult I think. Wtf kind of an insult is "0 effort passoid" anyway???
i think the emphasis was on 0 effort because at the time i pretty much exclusively wore grey tracksuits. i figured yk she's from ireland she's said some kinda leftie things she's probably chill we're both desperate to move
My condolences
Are you a fan of MC Devvo? https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ZalFGiS36go
he did nothing wrong
I found a YouTube link in your comment. Here are links to the same video on alternative frontends that protect your privacy:
Hello everyone, how are you all!!! Hopefully good!!! Anyways have a great week, much love 🥰🥰🥰🏳️⚧️🏳️⚧️🏳️⚧️🥰🥰🥰
i keep looking in the mirror and thinking how much i don't look like a girl, but i always immediately follow that thought up with "yeah and imagine how funny it's going to be in the before and after pics when you're the cutest girl in this hemisphere" and immediately start giggling to myself
nothing gives me a bigger sense of superiority than having bigger boobs than my cis friends
honestly the only reason I don't "want" tits is that if they come in faster than i'm ready to come out then I'm kind of screwed, but like,
oh my, yes please
join your local ibtc chapter
Gotta mogg the cissies
My friend who recently got on testosterone told me yesterday that their mood has like, substantially improved since starting T and that they’ve started liking themselves more in just a few weeks… damn this HRT shit really is magic, huh. I can’t wait to try it out for myself.
Me 4(+) years ago: I want to be more feminine. I want to be "mistaken" for a girl.
[Does fuck all, except having these thoughts for years]
Me now: I'm trans.
Wow, well done Edward for finally internalising this. Too bad the younger you would write about this in your notebook and then throw it out, not like we would ever want it later would we?
Now what Edward? Time for change, or do we just continue with the same policy.
WHICH WAY, TRANSGENDER WOMAN?
Nope. Business as usual is much better.
I mean you don't, that's a choice you can make for yourself whenever you like. You can always mess around without doing anything so earth-shaking. Try epilating, paint your nails, maybe a bit of feminising hormone therapy on the side, y'know?
I have actually shaved before. And worn thigh-highs, and skirts.
Good idea.
No I don't.
Alright well y'know, point is you can play with your presentation and self as much or as little as you want, however much you are comfortable with
Feeling really good today largely from all the support I've gotten here lately.
Thank you everyone
::: spoiler cw: transphobia but it's funny joke
uhm actually when archeologists dig up your skeleton in like 1,000 years or whatever they'll know your REAL gender

archeologists in 1,000 years when they dig up my remains and find a SPOOKY SCARY SKELETON:
:::
shivers down my spine even just at the thought
"am i really trans?" i don't know what it means to be "really trans" but calling myself a girl in my head is the first time in 20+ years i have ever respected myself so fuck it I'll keep doing it
I respect the troops
And stand for the flag
I may be trans, I think, but idk
Hi, welcome & tell us more if you wish!
Sure. Just not sure if I fit anywhere. Is non-binary trans? Eh, maybe. I don't know.
I may be genderqueer or non-binary. Definitely autigender.
Of course, yes! Also you fit here
Noice! I will keep looking into this stuff.
I'm definitely of the opinion that enbies are trans, though some don't identify with the label
I just don't know what to do with the info that I'm trans. Do I go through surgery? I don't want to. I, err, like my body, so to speak; it has more to do with the fact that I don't like masculinity, I guess.
Sometimes it doesn't have to do anything with medically transitioning. It can also be unprogramming certain behaviors that you think are unhelpful, voice work, and presentation. Some people can also feel ok the way they are
I'm personally a very binary and a typical trans woman, so I'm not exactly the best on explaining enby experiences, but I can help if you need any info
Thank you!
Yes, I don't really want to transition right now.
I've just never felt like a typical "man."
I do tend to recommend people that are playing with their gender to try voice work. At minimum, its a cool party trick to make yourself sound androgynous, masc, or feminine. At best, it can make you feel a lot more comfortable and may make you better at singing. It also has low social impact (people can't see youre experimenting), you can just use it when you feel comfortable. Usually within a couple months of daily practice you can have some really noticeable gains.
Hello, fellow dwarf planet.
Yesterday, I felt gender euphoria for the first time in ages. My hair is constantly getting longer and longer, and my freeform dreads looked in a way that made me feel much more feminine than usual. I'm also 6 months into HRT, and I'm just noticing changes that are there, but I can't quite pinpoint what they are. My eyes are definitely seeing things differently. It was a good vibe even though I still have quite a long way to go before I'm truly as feminine as I want to be. It definitely, at the very least, is a nice break from how much I've been hating how "mannish" my eyes have been perceiving myself recently.
Always love when you can trust your eyes & see beautiful things (yourself, looking good) through them
Before I decided to transition, I was nervous that if I did it would change "me", but actually the opposite has happened. I realised earlier this week that I feel more like myself than I have in years. This is how I used to be before. Me without all the pretending and bitterness and fear and all the other bs that hid away the person I actually am.
It's nice. I used to like the person I was, and I'm realising that's always been me, just hiding away under a bunch of failed coping mechanism. I supressed so much of my behaviours and wants because they weren't "masculine". I'm not changing into someone else, I'm finally able to be my authentic self, and it's amazing to recognize that part of myself after so many years of denying it.
It was a little jarring to get together with some of my guy friends and they were talking about weight/lifting and then they started teasing me for being small (I'm objectively not). I never realized how much being large was tied up in masculinity. Like obviously being tall would be, but I didn't realize how much weight was. They all just wanted to bulk up and get huge.
...and I just don't. ::: spoiler cw for body hatred and ED I'm always missing the days of when I was smaller, even if I wasn't any healthier. I hate how big and gross I feel. :::
::: spoiler worried about being trans I'm scared. I don't want to be trans. Why can't these feelings just go away. I don't know if I'm a transwoman but I'm still scared. Why can't I just be a normal guy. I hate society. If it weren't for this FUCKING SOCIETY it would all be okay. I could shave, I could dress how I want, maybe even give hrt a spin. But I can't. Its just too hard. I'm crying. I hate gender. Goodnight Hexbear. Sorry for the trauma dump, this one got out of hand. :::
::: spoiler Trans Mega, but I terrify you with nonsense The only thing I have desired in my adult life is to talk about books I like with people. How hard can that possibly be, right?
Dante Must Die Mode. It seems like 95% of the time I'd be more productive holding people up at gunpoint and treating it like an interrogation. Sucks to suck; the precious few times I've been able to do it, that shit's like a drug. Please, I beg of you, we can talk about this forever, I have headcanons and fundamental misunderstandings!
Something that's been rolling around my head for years now is that, in
Nevada by Imogen BinnieOrange Book Bad, there's this one bit where Maria Griffiths in her narration observes some total bullshit about genderqueer identities, which is not epic and I'm actually gonna cw for transphobia:QUOTE
ENDQUOTE
Wow, I should post literal Nevada quotes online more often. This is fun!!
Anyway on its face this is stupid for a whole fucking mess of reasons I'm pretty sure, like Orange Book Bad itself references Gender Outlaw once or twice, (slightly dimly, fwiw) and this kind of read is noooot compatible with Bornstein's read of gender as a class system. Ah yes, a non-cis identity is privileged and only available to one assigned gender...? Fuck off with that. It's sort-of consistent with Binnie's short I Met A Girl Named Bat in 2012's The Collection as well, which uses "both genders" once, maybe just for the sake of being an asshole.
The thing is, I have constantly wondered if I am missing something, or this is a bit or whatever, like an inside joke.This read feels kind of fucking stupid, but I don't have any other evidence by which to prove or disprove its shittiness. You can also observe that most people would rightly not bother, and dismiss it as a dogshit take. I'm slightly biased though, if Orange Book Bad is shitty, I desire to know exactly on what level and why.
Another factor is that someone could crawl out of the woodwork and be like "I lived next to a trans girl who said she was friends with Binnie, its actually a brilliant deliberate example of what an immovably awful person Maria is, Binnie said so" or something like that. I have low knowledge about this specific brainrot subject of books, so that's a possibility. I only want to understand shit. :::
::: spoiler i like talking books! now i still haven't read nevada, BUT i do have some knowledge on (some permutations of) this discourse. i could definitely see this being an intentional she's an asshole thing, but it's not unheard of for trans women to have problems with this sort of thing. this specifically reads as truscum rhetoric (especially given it sitting right next to "how do i get hormones" which kinda frames hrt and medical transition as the good trans and genderqueer afab people as the bad ones) but even outside truscum spaces there are some transfem people who are very bitter about transmisogyny and lash out at trans people who they see as more privileged (the bitterness isn't unjustified but obviously taking it out on other trans people like that is) and who are viewed as perpetuating transmisogyny (which many tme people do but like, that doesn't make them not trans)
one specific complaint is that these genderqueer afab people are often just seen as women by society at large and therefore don't have to face the level of transphobia of more binary trans people, especially trans women. ti ve clear this is bullshit, genderqueer identities being seen as just quirky women is itself pretty self evidently transphobia. while i am not entirely unsympathetic to some of the things that lead to this line of thinking (there are obviously some genderqueer people who enact transmisogyny, even if there are obviously way more cis people who do) it is still incredibly harmful and any transmisogyny in tme trans spaces can and must be addressed in ways that do not invalidate other people's transness. the term "theyfab" (which i don't like and think is bad) is used by some in this context. sometimes it's to make a specific point about, for example, spaces that exclude amab trans people but welcome afab trans people (a real problem! still doesn't justify what feels to me like tacit misgendering) but sometimes it's just a derogatory way to talk about the group and implicitly deny their transness
anyways that's where i feel like this is coming from. obviously cannot promise this is specifically what's going on, and im very tired so i might be missing something or communicating poorly. lotta discourse, im not an expert, but that's the vibes i get. hope this was helpful, im going to sleep now so if it wasn't i can't help
::: spoiler aw yiss!!! Yes, that was my instant assumption too. It reads very similarly to "just woman-lite" arguments used against nonbinary people. It's sickeningly ironic in this case because Orange Book Bad references Bornstein and Serano, it's how I was introduced to Gender Outlaw and Whipping Girl, so it's not like the author is unaware? Which, I don't really desire to CANCEL IMOGEN BINNIE or whatever, the trouble is that Maria Griffiths kind of seems like a self insert in many ways, oops. It blows me away that a binary trans person could see genders outside the binary as being privileged, lol. The main reason I lean away from the theoretical "It's deliberate, it's about how Maria is an asshole!" argument is that for pretty much every other bit of blogosphere-quasi-lecturing-narration, Maria says very agreeable stuff and it seems like the reader is meant to agree so Idk.
Even if it were true that gq afab people were "just seen as women by society" that would not make them exempt from transphobia and discrimination anyway, yes!!!! You know what though, Nevada does have a lil passage about spaces that allow afab trans people but not amab:
Of course the text is sort of unrelentingly shitty about it, and also I have never heard the term which is probably a gen x thing, so that's a funny thing. Nevada is not a book that's kind to other trans people (JUST WAIT TILL YOU HEAR ABOUT ITS TAKES ON TRANS MEN!) and it's probably the aspect of it I hate the most. This is kinda like the primordial roots of the Bad Discourse that led to TME/TMA being adopted to start!
Sorry to hear that ur tired (sleep! sleep is good!) but I greatly appreciate the insight, you have connected a few dots in my brain I think. The more I look at this, the less there seems to be plausible deniability - or even if it's an intentional show of the protagonist being shitty, it's kind of going too far with it. Like, if the reader was not interested in hearing Maria's ridiculous stream of consciousness after this, I would not blame them in the slightest. Of course I have brainrot anyway, so
but very good stuff.
:::
::: spoiler book talk lets gooooo I think this specific issue with Nevada is very emblematic of Imogen Binnie's brand of trans feminism (at least at the time, I can't remember if it's addressed in the second edition's afterword). The book is very white and very american, and Maria is shown to be relatively privileged. It's to the point where I don't fault anyone for not being able to read, enjoy, or relate to it for reasons past the blogpost narration.
I do kinda get that feeling of Maria being a self-insert in many ways which kinda taints the book a bit. However I also see Maria as a great example of "bad representation" in that while her character embodies some important parts of the trans experience, she's still a somewhat problematic and messy individual who exemplifies the parts of the trans experience that aren't spotlighted anywhere else. Whether it's intentional or not is definitely arguable and it definitely wasn't necessary to tell the story Imogen Binnie wanted to write, but I think that it could also just a product of the time it was written in.
::: spoiler ayooooo!! Yes indeed, Nevada is a 0 intersectionalism text, which is deeply annoying since it's half a cultural touchstone. It's weird too because a few times Maria does point out stuff like say, getting the benefit of the doubt for being tall, white and attractive, but it's kind of nothing more than lipservice when shit like the above is being said too. I actually dunno how much I could recommend it anymore tbh...
She works the same job that Imogen Binnie did, the Camp Trans/Michigan Womyns Festival shit is definitely a Binnie thing 'cause iirc she met some Topside writers there irl, I have always considered her to be a mouthpiece. You are right though about the "bad representation" thing, and I think that's why Nevada has such staying power. (with me, at least, lmao) Maria sucks so bad and I love her, I never get tired of seeing her total all of her relationships and fuck everything up 'cause she's all messed up and sad
the abrasiveness is part of the appeal, right?
I just kinda feel like the shit she says about genderqueer people and trans men are over the line, from "messy and problematic" to "divisive wrecker", I guess. I have seen it put people off once or twice, and I'm not convinced the book would not be improved if you just cut this bs about trans men "taking up space from trans women" and whatever.
Also it's weird because Nevada being big means that a lot of subsequently influenced trans fiction (Detransition Baby, Tell Me I'm Worthless, Manhunt) lean into the whole, gen-x-transfemme-who-browsed-fictionmania thing a lot, which I think is a bit quaint to most people now. It's definitely unique!
Actually unironically, if I'd known this was gonna go so well I would have aired my grievances with Nevada way sooner. This thread is great & everyone in it is lovely
:::
::: spoiler my two cents i guess as a tme trans person with some passing familiarity in this discourse i don’t feel particularly offended by these kinds of comments because I know that because of transmisogyny i have structural privilege over tma trans people. so a transfemme making a snarky comment about trans men or afab gq people, even if it dips into some unideal “invalidating gender” territory, isn’t nearly on the same level as the violent transmisogyny that gets perpetrated from those groups.
i’ve yet to read whipping girl which is on my reading list but i think serano discusses the divide between tme/tma trans people a bit too. ultimately i think it’s more important for us tme trans people to deal with transmisogyny in our communities first, because these kinds of comments are just a reaction to the dynamics of unrecognized privilege and violent exclusion in these transmisogynistic trans spaces. idk, just my thoughts though and i don’t want to invalidate your experience with nevada especially as I haven’t read it. :::
::: spoiler lfg!!! Hi, I welcome any thoughts on this subject!
I'm glad at least to see that the quotes aren't that offensive to their targets, lol. I agree that it's nothing like the violent transmisogyny we experience, to me I guess it's about yet more divisive shit in the trans community, and also maybe that anger could be directed at dogshit cis people who commit the vast majority of that violent transmisogyny, instead of our comrades? It seems kind of bastardy to be bitterly invalidating people's genders instead? Down with cis? Just spitballing, Idk. I don't disagree with your comment overall, I appreciate the alternate view actually. Doesn't invalidate my experience :)
Man I still gotta read Whipping Girl, look at me being a genderlib and not reading theory! :::
::: spoiler more book more book Oh! I just remembered!
These last two comments reminded me about a specific part of Whipping Girl that I think can elaborate a bit on the kind of thinking that informed Imogen Binnie and possibly led to these views.
In the last chapter of Whipping Girl, Serano touches on the topic of subversivism within the feminist movements of the time (90s to the early 10's).
There's quite a bit more than what I've put below, but I remember feeling conflicted when I first finished this chapter. Obviously today definitions have changed and the idea of political lesbians and genderqueer identities has shifted. I wanted to understand more after finishing the book in regards to this topic but the trans spaces I looked in were severely lacking in even basic transmisogyny discussion, so I had no hope of finding more on it.
::: spoiler Passages attached
does anyone have any good resources on trying to look for housing as a trans person? like, i feel like i should put up a craigslist posting saying something like "pre everything trans femme looking for queer roommates" or something but idk what i should/shouldn't do or what to look out for
is my voice supposed to be breathy during voice training? i feel like i'm targeting the right muscles for resonance but idk. wish there was a more understandable timeline for it
Yes it is kinda breathy until you build up your muscles in the top of your throat. Have some protein after practicing too. Be sure you're not doing falsetto. You should get up to falsetto and be in the notch just below it and build that up
It took me 3-4 months of daily practice, usually 1-2 hrs per day to get anywhere on the voice
Okay wow this helps a ton, thank you.
I really wish online resources were more than "just tighten your throat and da da da da congrats you have feminized your voice"
No problem. I also suggest finding a phrase and sticking to that to practice. Like a short song or something, but just say the words in your speaking voice. Then stick to that for all of your voice training going forward, and also record yourself and compare to previous attempts. This will help you target the right muscles and build them up.
If you feel your voice is still too low, don't be discouraged. As you build those muscles up you get better control of them and can slowly squeeze it higher and higher over time. Try not to force anything, straining your voice can really hurt and put you out of commission for days
There are some good and some bad international news I'd like to talk about: In Germany, a self-id law is likely to pass parliament in the next days. It's not ideal (mandatory consultation for minors, no binary passports for nonbinary people, no transfem gender marker change during wartime, some dogwhistle-y sentences without legal meaning), but at least they struck the part about automatically reporting every gender marker change to the police. It replaces an older law which required two psychiatric evaluations costing thousands of Euros, so that's good.
On the bad side, in the UK the Cass review was published. It's a "systematic" review of gender care for minors and unsurprisingly, it comes to the conclusion that minors should not get gender-affirming care. Even social transition should not happen without a doctor supervising it. It was obviously planned as a hatchet job from the very beginning by choosing unqualified doctors with clear anti-trans position to write it. As always, the media is failing its duty to accurately report on institutional transphobia while Labour is loudly embracing it. The NHS is now planning to do the same thing with adult gender care, so I can only express my horror at the continuing decline of TERF island.
kind of want to "retire" this account for no other reason than i want to change my username to something aggressively transfemme. I have something in mind so far but I'm still kind of hesitant with it for some reason
me bugging my friends after i've been feeling dysphoric all day
Why did I waste years of my life as an egg?
I know you all knew!
If you gaze long enough into the estrogen, the estrogen will gaze back into you.
i find it a bit strange in hindsight to ask when the exact "day" i figured out i was trans was. Like, there is a day where I really did say "oh damn none of this is cis" but for the two-three months before that i was obviously in so much denial it was degrading. I was doing/saying just... unbelievably eggy things that really just didn't have a cisgender explanation to them but I still 100% totally believed were "still cis though". I think of it like "what radicalized you", because no one even ever turns some squishy liberal into a hardened communist in a day, that shit takes years
Sometimes I look down when I'm reading a book or whatever and I'm like "ayo, boobs, incredible!" you would think after nearly a decade the novelty woulda worn off, but uh I guess I'll never get tired of the "soft curve". Hydrodynamic, as Maryam calls it...
Why though? I'm kinda like, if gender is hugely culturally constructed, why so pleased to have boobs? They do not do anything, they're arguably inconvenient? Idgi, but my brain sure does.
One of the weird things about my existence is that I didn't really spend a second thinking about it when I first discovered what transition was, I just went "k imma girl now" and followed my gut. Good instinct, very cool of me, but it means I have done almost zero critical thinking about my own gender, ig.
Back to work... aaaaaannnddddd my anxiety is back haha. I wish I could take a month off work.
On a totally seperare note the trader Joe's daily facial sunscreen is so comfortable. Not too expensive either my plan is to wear it for laser treatment but just a heads up!
oh what do you mean i only got the HRT appointment done 3 days ago i could have sworn it's been like 2 months already
I would like the input of the experienced and wise trans sages of hexbear.
I've been going through a years long process of gender experimentation that has intensified lately. I feel like something just hasn't clicked for me yet.
There are times when I'm perfectly happy to be a non-gender conforming man, and there are other times when I feel the call of the woman very strongly. There are times when I really like having a beard and getting bigger as I increase my muscle mass. I want to clarify that I like these things. It's not just default to me. But there are other times where these same features (mostly the facial hair) fucking kill me. Then there are other in-between times where I don't feel feminine but I wish I did, and I just get sad that I don't feel that way.
I've been going by she/her at home lately, and sometimes it feels good, and other times it doesn't. Most of the time, it just feels fake (I know this is normal).
Sometimes I really want to try HRT, and other times I'm scared of the permanent changes. While the idea of having a vagina seems cool, I actually don't want to get rid of my penis.
I could be experiencing some kind of bigender or gender fluid thing, but honestly, the emotional whiplash is just exhausting. I'm trying my best to just enjoy who I am at the time, regardless of whether it's masculine or feminine, but this makes me feel like I'm using femininity and womanhood like a costume instead an actual gender identity (okay, now that I'm typing this out, I'm seeing similarities to a lot of other trans people).
Am I having a unique experience, or is this just regular dysphoria stuff? Tbh, I feel kind of fraudulent hanging out here sometimes.
Also being scared of the unknown, permanent changes is very common.
Cw discussion of dysphoria
::: spoiler spoiler This sounds a bit like gender fluidity. Generally the rule of thumb is to transition to fix your lows for gender fluid people. If you feel suicidal over something, it's better to fix that than to feel good about something later, if that makes sense. Suicide is very permanent
But it's really important to measure how you feel when going about hrt for gender fluid and nonbinary people. I would suggest keeping a journal of your thoughts, what you were doing that day, and see if anything triggers the desire to feel one way or the other. Keep doing this, then if you think you've found a pattern,try something new, and then measure that.
Id like to point out that I'm very binary, but this is advice a genderfluid person I know gave to someone else. In general it seems hellish to me, you never really get rid of dysphoria completely if you are gender fluid.
For me as a trans woman, I never really felt good about my masculine characteristics. Muscularity id argue isn't necessarily one, but beards and so on are. Id even argue feeling fine about your penis is common enough for trans women. I could understand when I looked good to other people, but never felt that way myself, it felt like something was just off about it. It felt like my eyes never had any light in them, I couldn't figure out how to smile naturally, I felt like my skull was weird, my skin felt wrong (like it didn't have enough fat under it or something,or the texture was wrong). I felt kinda perpetually disgusted about all the tiny things T does to you :::
Thank you for your insight, as always
::: spoiler dysphoria
Not going to lie, I just kept reading this sentence over and over, and I had to get up and walk around because I felt like I was gonna barf. Because yeah, it kind of feels like that. Anyway, that sudden spike in dysphoria is actually instructive for me. I'll follow the signal and reflect on why I feel that way.
I notoriously don't smile. Like, that's a thing about me that people comment on. My wife, unprompted, has said that I just look happier when I'm presenting femme. I smile in the mirror more when I'm femme. Also, random people and friends compliment me when I'm dressed femme. When dressed femme, I get more compliments in a week than I probably ever have in a lifetime of dressing masc. I also just generally feel a wider range of emotions when femme.
I'm also grossed out by a lot of T stuff. My skin, in particular feels wrong. Body hair, etc.
So, I think it's good advice to keep a journal, but I don't see the connection to HRT. Could you explain? :::
So for some genderfluid people, they can have triggers that cause them to "swap" gender identity. If you measure these things you can find ways to avoid "swapping".
Again, just spit balling here, but measuring your mood, what you did, what seemed to trigger dysphoria, you might figure out if you're that flavor of gender fluid. Your experience is definitely out of the norm for a trans woman, but it could be you have hangups that are cultural too that are confusing it. (Re: muscularity, women with penises) It's possible you could be a lot of things
I think the important thing is to try to measure stuff so you have a more concrete list of things going on. For example I helped a xenogender person irl that seemed to have swaps based on sunlight, turns out the swap was based on vitamin d and taking that helped them stay more towards one identity
That's fucking wild
I don't want to avoid swapping all together because I like the expression, but having more control would be helpful.
Thank you so much
Hmm. While I am fully committed to wanting to medically transition now, it actually took me a while to reach that conclusion because I had a period of a few months literally right before my initial "oh shit" gender questioning moment when I had finally begun to feel like maybe I would be happy being a girl. (Needless to say... I did not stay a girl.)
::: spoiler dysphoria talk I'm not a binary trans person, but I also am pretty set in my non-binary experience of gender, and it very distinctly isn't in any way related to my agab (I get a lot of dysphoria when gendered as a girl/woman.)
However, for a while when I was first questioning, I thought that I didn't experience a lot of physical dysphoria, just social dysphoria. As a result, I thought that maybe I didn't want to medically transition because I, too, was scare of permanent changes. So during this questioning phase, there were times when I quite liked my more "feminine" body, and times when I wished I had different fat distribution. There were times when I liked my boobs and times when I hated how much they gendered me. But the more I got misgendered, the more uncomfortable I got, and I began to solidify both my experience of physical dysphoria and how I wanted to transition. I know some nonbinary people are okay with getting read as their agab, but I really wasn't.
All in all, it took my about two years to fully decide that I wanted to medically transition, which is where I'm at now. There are still some things that I don't really want to change, though. I very much do not want a penis, so I never pack and I have no intention of getting phalloplasty. Top surgery is still somewhat of a toss-up that I've been waffling on for a while, but I think I'm starting to come down on the side of "yeah get these off" (frankly I wish for velcro boobs, but I think that it's easier for me to just fake having boobs when I want them rather than to bind when I don't.) I also do not really want to pass as a cis manly man, I just really want to stop getting gendered as a woman (which all strangers do to me. I do not pass at all.) Really, what I want is to be confusing.
Idk if any of this helps but I thought I would just word vomit a little. It would be really nice if we could just shapeshift at will, lol. :::
It does. A lot. So many of your thoughts parallel my own perfectly, so it's nice to see it expressed.
I really wish we could just shapeshift.
One major issue for me is I really can't imagine myself as an old woman. I want to be a bearded old dude, so I don't want to get rid of my beard or detransition and have testosterone issues in my old age. Maybe it's just deep brainworms acting up considering how women are treated like garbage the more they age while men are treated like a fine wine idk. Maybe if I take your route, I'll figure out what I actually want. Maybe it wouldn't actually bother me.
But RIGHT NOW, the push to feminize is quite strong. I've still got like 3 decades before I'd consider myself an old man. Do I just take half measures and repress during that time? I don't know.
also funny in retrospect is how easy it was to finally get rid of the "why does it feel like it's literally impossible to look in the mirror and feel attractive?" feelings that i've had for as long as I can remember because all I did was:
and I was asking "Uhm, Hel-lo Ma'am??? 😳 before i even got to step 3. by that point i had to sit down what the fuck what do you mean it was this easy????
Being trans is like a keep trying not to die challenge every day forever, it is hard not to become bitter.
sometimes i wonder if i'm really "trans" or not. i always respond to that by recalling just how long i genuinely, desperately, earnestly tried to be a cis man
it didn't fuckin work, and i need to remember that
Switching to patches from pills tomorrow now that I don't need to hide my being trans from anyone I live with. Is there any particularly good spot to place it or am I fine just putting it on my thigh?
I heard places with thinner skin and more blood near the surface are good, like inner thighs.
Welcome to hell, losers. I hate to be doing this, but I gotta. Discussion of Unjust Depths 13.8, ft. a side of sexual topics:
::: spoiler Open mouth, insert foot...
I hate Karuniya Maharapratham.
Die, Chaser Scum: An Essay (not really)
All of Karuniya and Murati’s scenes together in Arc 1, like up to book 3 when the Brigand departs, no problems no questions. Usage of gendered terms like "prince" and "husband material" spooked me, but I’m weird so sure, Murati is a tomboy, no big. I’m certain it’s just a Gender thing. Then there's that one time we get to follow Karuniya onboard the Brigand doing her science-y shit, she seems maybe a little sex-brained but whatever, it's not like that's a cardinal sin, okay. It is at that point though that the suspicions start to rise, because the way she uses "fuck" feels like it has a very specific charge. But still, sure, ok, no big.
By the time book 8 has rolled around and we get a Karuniya-POV flashback, I was all excited! Finally, she can become her own character! She spends it either condescending Murati’s ideological commitments through narration, or thinking about fat cock.
I was already primed to hate Karuniya for her dim view of Murati's little protest, when she chains herself to the simulator doors and demands 24/7 access and proper training so that academy students have a proper chance to become pilots. Great Murati moment; Karuniya’s reaction to this is mostly bemused and mean-spirited, thinking about possible physical ways to remove her, wishing to see every second that she’s on those doors, for her "entertainment". Like it's cute that she gets thinking about commitment to causes or whatever as a result of this but, you slanderous snake. Grrrr.
The vast majority of this flashback is spent on their first-ever date though, and oh man. Does Karu ever think about anything other than girldick?
I don’t even wanna know what “dick game” means lol. She also has mind-space to think about “pegging” though, I guess:
Might be embarrassing myself here but I have only ever heard that particular term used for dudes, Idk. Even if you can square that it’s still weird though, Like sure Karuniya cares about Murati's career aspirations blah blah, but she goes into their date all dick dick dick dick dick and nothing else. Weird-ass cumbrained motherfucker.
Look right, Alexandra Genivov is a horny lady. Hell, Adelheid and Norn are basically doing a brat/brat tamer bit 24/7, and I still like those three. A lot, actually; Genivov's intro is kind of uncomfortable sure, but her thing with de la Rosa and how they nudge back and forth about their hobbies is cute! Similarly I know who Adelheid is outside of just being horny too, like her thoughts whenever they're tearing through that station and Adelheid is all concerned for Norn’s safety, or when Adelheid brings Norn back out of the Aer stream with her psy powers this very chapter right? I know that Adelheid is not just a freak about Norn because we've spent time in her head, seen how she feels generally. Hell, even given that I thought Adelheid’s dick-questioning was a bit strange, the whole subsequent scene coming after Norn was brooding in the shower is actually a great moment for them both. Yas, praetorian, slay, take out ur frustrations on that silly bitch(with aftercare)! Genivov only even has like three scenes before this chapter and I still have a better sense for who she is! Actually funnily enough, Genivov is having some silly character moments right after this, too. Her horny gamer bit is genuinely not that eye-rolling. "It'd be such a bottom move" is actually kinda funny, it would be a bottom move not to land that torpedo in time with the artillery round.
With Karuniya, literally all she does is think about dick, it seems. The one time we've been allowed to follow her perspective on the Brigand and hear about her thoughts, her occupation and stuff... gets interrupted with her thinking about dick. Rrrrrgh why is it like this, it’s worse because Murati is really charming in this flashback.
Also though Karuniya is a neurotypical; I get that there are gonna be neurotypicals in this best-selling webnovel, but it's so painfully weird to watch her internally commentate her own date and bitch at Murati, picking over her every word and griping at her alleged social gaffes:
‘Teehee you’re so quirky, fuck me already!’ I hate this. Karuniya just does not stop with the “Play hard-to-get for a bit” and wanting to “poke fun” at Murati, she’s so fucking weird. No other character in this webnovel so far has actively repulsed me just with their manner of speaking, which puts Karuniya below Sawyer and Selene on the Unjust Depths Shit Character List.
It gets worse, though:
My reaction in order was 1) die neurotypical bitch, 2) am I fucking mistaken, isn’t the person you are talking to also a lady??? Are you just deliberately being a freak, what is your conception of Murati, Karuniya, do I even want to know? Karuniya is apparently oblivious though, so when Murati kindly tries to let it slide unacknowledged, Karuniya must bring it up again, as if for effect:
I feel so fucking bad for Murati here. I get that the bit here is likely supposed to be that Murati is an oblivious dork and Karuniya is enjoying prodding her, it’s supposed to be cute, but instead this scene reads like Karuniya has made a social gaffe of APOCALYPTIC proportions, Murati tried to let it slide, but Karuniya just cannot stop being fucking weird. Holy shit, just ask for her dick size, cut the goddamn pretense.
What the hell is that even supposed to mean? Coincidentally this exchange is not helping Karuniya to beat the neurotypical allegations, I’m pretty sure “queen bee” does not have a positive connotation. What is it about what Murati said that was dorky? ^I^ ^don’t^ ^understand^ ^people...^ And one more, just to rub in how shitty and weird Karuniya is:
WHY INDEED YOU ABSOLUTE FREAK, holy shit if I were Murati I'd be having a fucking panic attack, I'd be paranoid for fucking WEEKS.
Why exactly Murati wants to have sex with this woman after that, what the fuck she sees in this painfully unaware neurotypical fucker, is beyond me. That’s the lead-in to them fucking after the date, though; I must be missing something. After that ends we get a quick look at Karuniya’s perspective about their little disagreement at Thassalid station, something about feeling lesser, but by that point it becomes kind of late for ruminating on their relationship, whatever. I already know Karuniya is a fucking weirdo, I honestly kind of don’t care what she thinks anymore.
I consider this to be Karuniya's character assassination. These are her innermost thoughts: a garbage dump. I had been very mildly suspicious of her in prior chapters, but I brushed it away because eh, I’m probably just being paranoid or weird. Her behaviour in this chapter is basically my worst possible fears made manifest though, and to me this shit casts aspersions on all previous chapters. Maybe the "husband material" thing was her being fucking weird after all, since it potentially doesn't really seem like she'd internalised Murati as "female" by their first date, based on the evidence. Fucking gross!
That was such a fucking weird interjection, too, coming just after/before Karuniya and Murati launch in the “Helios” two-pilot diver. Marina’s flashback shows us what kind of life she’s led and why she’s still motivated to fight; why did we need to know that Karuniya is a fucking freak before she deploys? The intent was probably for the backstory to strengthen their relationship textually, but that fucking backfired. You truly could have just cut that dogshit flashback, because the subsequent fight is actually fun. Helios reporting for duty, y’know, it’s like Darling in the Franxx but less horny, I guess?
From this, I halfway get the sense that the Karuniya who exists when their relationship is under pressure or on the rocks, is a fundamentally different person from the one idly daydreaming about "dick-game-out-of-this-world" or Murati fucking her roommate years ago. Maybe we will get some actual character development, as a little treat, to see how Karuniya quit being a weirdo? But the text doesn’t seem aware that she is, so I’m not hopeful.
I hate this, someone please tell me I'm wrong for feeling this and logic it out at me. :::
::: spoiler oh no i don't know that i can prove you wrong? i think the intention is that like, transness is so normalized in the union for most people (at least of the younger generation who grew up firmly after the revolution) that karuniya is maybe overly horny but not in a way that means anything, and starts off as very self absorbed in that flashback but we're supposed to read her as having gotten better about it by the present if that makes sense. but like. in OUR world people who act like that are definitely fetishistic at best
i will say (without having gone back and reread that chapter/flashback) i do remember thinking the purpose of the flashback was mostly to show the history of their relationship, go "hey karuniya admires murati's passion about communism and theory and stuff, here's how they got close and the strength of their bond", but yeah it doesn't seem great when laid out like that!
::: spoiler Oh yes, I'm sorry lmao Haha whoops =) I did consider that, the "normalisation" angle, and yeah maybe but this shit with Karuniya also feels considerably weirder than comparable things from Norn/Adelheid or Genivov. Doesn't help that Murati often seems really uncomfortable/awkward in response to this weird shit: this flashback, the first time "husband material" is brought up. I do have my own oversensitivity in mind when I'm thinking this, but shit was eating at my brain
If Karuniya has gotten better, it'd be cute if she would do that on-page instead of in secret and we have to assume it... I think it's not just that she is horny, or that she is terribly self-absorbed; it's gotta be the combination of those PLUS the fact that she has borderline nothing else going on. It throws this weird stuff into focus and I overthink and then write 2000+ words about it on bear website 
I didn't exactly see them get close though? I mostly saw Karuniya being a weird, belittling, judgemental neurotypical (yes I am slandering her) about everything Murati likes and cares about, and wanting to have sex with her. The date was painfully awkward and not in a cute way... Tbh it kind of seems like even still today Karuniya is kind of weird about Murati's career pursuits. Idk, does Karuniya EVER talk to anybody other than Murati? Does she exist without Murati in the room, even? And yet she is this weird, how exactly is it that the PROTAGONIST'S WIFE has so little in the way of character traits or development?
:::
Hey so like I have literally 0 connection with this person other than that I just stumbled on their Reddit posts, and they seem to be a trans woman facing imminent eviction, or might be getting evicted today I guess since the post is 4 days old
idk I just thought I should maybe share their post here? since I can't imagine anywhere else on the internet being more willing to help them? idk.
again, I don't know this person but their account is like 14 years old so I imagine they're probably a real person very much in need
here's their post regarding their imminent eviction
A Reddit link was detected in your comment. Here are links to the same location on alternative frontends that protect your privacy.
god i have got to stop browsing r/mtfashion it is filling my head with all sorts of bad ideas. or maybe they're good ones? idk but i feel like this much gender envy can't be good for me
Found a new outfit today at a thrifty shop that is honestly fucking amazing. It's so cute. It's just also quite warm and it's getting warmer so... whatever. It's always good to find a good outfit that breaks the rut because ive been feeling very good in my baggy jeans - tank top - flannel outfit (im starting to look like a cartoon character lol).
As a balm after The Worst Post You Have Ever Seen, here is a normal chapter update:
::: spoiler Unjust Depths 8.13-8.14 spoilers The rest of the Brigand v Antenora battle is going really well. I like the Helios' atypical combat style, the antiflooding solution to disarm Gertrude's mech was fuckin genius, and the drones going out and lighting up everyone's imaging so that Dominika can obliterate that Volkannon was rad too. I said it above but Genivov gets a lot out of this chapter. Using her goofy gamerbrain skills to coordinate her torpedo strike with de la Rosa's artillery barrage, in hopes of doing something right for once, it's a great moment when a segment of the Antenora floods like a BITCH, OOOOOOO!!! Genivov deserves that handholding, I'm so glad she turned out to be more than just a horndog. No bottom moves from our torpedo specialist, no!
Also Gertrude fucking surrendered, holy shit. The crew of the Antenora is getting their collective asses exposed, and the exposed asses are all the asses of COMPLETELY PATHETIC LOSERS, I mean imagine being High Inquisitor and losing a fight to a seafloor exploration mech. Sucks to suck!
It was good of Fan-Favourite Cuttlefish™ to help Elena reach the bridge, and I greatly approve of Elena's big declaration. She would have probably been a hundred times safer and less awkward not revealing her identity, but she has gained initiative, values and a disdain for sitting pretty while letting other people fight her battles. Idk if she has fully earned this, since she hasn't talked to Marina in ages and she's mostly just been clowned on by the security team, but it's cool & I'm hoping this jumpstarts her character. Her decision to remain onboard the Brigand even in the face of Norn the Praetorian is rad.
Poor Genrtrude is really entering her villain era now though! Like Sieglinde she doesn't really have beliefs or convictions, so it sucks to suck (again) when your gf says "no" and you lose your entire reason for being! I could sort of tell from her overbearing nature that she might not respect Elena having autonomy, but woooooow she really flipped out, she's gonna be the NO ELENA YOU ARE MINE REEEEEE abusive ex now :/ rip high inquisitor, u will be missed after Norn fucking flays your ass, lol.
Also wow though, Sieglinde is coming with the underwater commies??? Kinda hyped for that. :::
::: spoiler bury your love at goryk's gorge INDEED the whole fight is really incredible! everyone gets their own thing to do, it rules so hard. geninov is great "it would be such a bottom move" is an incredible line and was running through my head the entire time you mentioned getting bad vibes from her earlier because it's so charming i can't imagine not liking her after that. i loved all the other little moments people got to shine, but that was my favorite. also sieglinde being so shaken by khadija that she ends up defecting is incredible, i love that so much
elena going up to the bridge and giving that whole speech and kinda dumping gertrude shoots her up many points in my book. it's really good! she's trying to become an actual person and not just royalty and i'm rooting for her! gertrude is SUCH a loser. she's so pathetic and weird about elena, and she's just so fixated on her that it makes her bad at everything else she does. she sucks but it's super juicy. this whole arc has really good drama
::: spoiler The title is multifaceted which is fun...
...like yo that leviathan was a cute Zachikova gf???
I know right, this arc is great for everybody. I wasn't really invested in disliking Genivov, she just weirded me out is all... but while I was already warming to her somewhat over her nightshift shenanigans, this sealed her place in the "good bitches" pantheon. I didn't mention it at the time but while I felt really bad for Shalikova when they met in the shower, it was kind of a fun scene for Genivov, lol. I actually want more from the torpedo/artillery chairs now!! It is an incredible battle, there were no goofy ass-pulls (I was expecting Shalikova to be saved by deus ex machina, but no!) Every time a Diver is onscreen it's a hype moment. Sonya is now going to see Maryam in the infirm though and OH BOY OH BOY
Yes!!! I knew she could fucking do it!!! She has to read theory now and start enjoying soy cutlets
Honestly she and Gertrude traded places in my rankings, I still love Gertrude but in a "she sucks but it's super juicy" way for sure. I cannot wait to see her do Real Villain shit, this origin story is going to make her future war crimes ✨ EXTRA SPICY ✨
:::
::: spoiler hell yeah yeah she is!!!!
i didn't think you really hated her, just that she has forever been tied to that line in my mind and i had to really force myself not to make like a coy little reference to it lmao. and yeah! the fights are so fucking good, madiha is really incredible at making them work in prose, which isn't easy. i always feel like i have enough of a sense of the mechanics to follow what's happening while not getting bogged down in details. and the divers are always so hype
elena is going to do it! she will read theory, she will join the proletariat, she will start eating the food that is available to her! by the end of the story she will be having theory discussions with murati on equal terms :::
::: spoiler lfg I'm glad I did not lol, I might have introduced her with more than just her going AWOOOGA a bunch, but yeah I get ya, it's a great line, lmao. Waa it an absolute top move when her strategy worked out then?
Weirdly enough the battles kinda remind me of the Halo novels (
)It is top shelf stuff, it is tough to balance both "not getting bogged down in the details" and "detailed enough that hype still occurs", ngl though I had forgotten that the Jagd has like, an inverted triangular chassis, lol
YOOOOOOOOOOOO
Oh no way, I never even considered that, I'm still slightly hesitant about our resident Dumb Bitch talking to Murati cause uh c: But I do look forward to her learning to be a real person.
:::
::: spoiler unjust deoths nah i think this is a no win scenario. the second you start saying "it would be an absolute bottom move" about stuff everything you do in response to that is also an absolute bottom move
yeah like, i don't always have a super consistent vision of the divers in my head (the jagd especially always looks like the jagd doga to me because of the name) but the fights work so well
elena will be one of the three pillars of communist thought in the union. (i mean, her becoming a real girl and not having imperial brainworms and being able to talk to poc without being weird about it is a more reasonable hope. but i like to dream big)
::: spoiler Deoths c: And so, the gunnery officers were both bottoms
lmao
One of the things I really want is for Marina and Elena to make up. I get why Elena is mad at her, and sure Marina is the single most brainwormed person in Unjust Depths, but I feel really incredibly bad for Marina busting her ass and devoting her life to the daughter that she, Leda and Bethany cared for so deeply, risking life and limb constantly to keep her safe, and getting that thrown back in her face. Elena should get cozy and start loving her new adoptive mother, because Bethany and Leda's wills (though hopefully not weird knifeplay forcefem habits) live on through Marina.
::: spoiler Weird Book Brainrot To me Marina feels like she walked out of any random trans litfic, like she has many of the aspects of a Maria Griffiths or a Jules Binachi(The Last Girl Scout) or even a Wendy(Little Fish), and it's very fascinating, her brainworms should rub up very strangely against the otherwise exclusively trans-positive-trans-normative world. I felt awful sadness when Ulyana and Aaliyah were getting the report from the doctor about how Marina is basically a walking trauma bucket, I wish to see her heal in general. :::
::: spoiler unjust deaths on everyone who makes fun of my typos yeah for sure. marina is a deeply tragic character, she has this daughter she's estranged from, she's the only character we've seen from the republic and has SO many brainworms. it fits with the brigand because it's part of making clear how much of a hellhole the republic was, but it's so sad. i really want to see her overcome her past and both have better opinions and also just have like, anything good? what if she got exposed to a fully trans positive society and maybe bonded with people and stopped calling them commies as a bad thing!
Steve lacy is so hot.
Bi people are so hot
Starting to get a bit worried about my hrt.
I had an AWFUL winter for a lot of reasons, it wasn't solely down to my hormones. But my hormones were def a contributing factor. I was taking injections and my estradiol levels were way too high and I always felt like shit. But I also felt like I couldn't lower the dose because then it always ran out before the end of the week, and taking more frequently always caused my levels to skyrocket even when I adjusted the dosage to compensate.
I'm taking estradiol by pill now and it's way way better, I feel good. But I'm not going back on spiro for a number of reasons, and I'm beginning to suspect my T levels are rising because I get morning wood occasionally. I know you can't really do estrogen monotherapy with pills, and I'm worried about my T levels, but I'm also feeling so good rn that I'm not sure I want to change anything.
I did (semi-)sublingual E monotherapy for a year and a half, so it's certainly possible, but I think that may depend heavily on your body's specific reactions to different hormones, sadly.
i want bigger boobs but i do not yet have the strength to do what i need to do
::: spoiler spoiler take prog rectally :::
Is it really that different from taking it orally?
It was entirely ineffective for me taken orally, and that's what everyone I know says that's how it is for everyone. Apparently you van do kg sublingually but it tastes awful
Hmmm, might have to switch types then. Thanks for the information.
It doesn't taste that bad!
perhaps i will try then...
never was into the idea of painting my nails but maybe it would get me to stop biting them all the damn time
I think it helped me the first time I painted them, but honestly I chip nail polish so fast they're kinda eff'd up after one day
it does make it a lot nicer to see my hands, would recommend :3
I'm literally in the process of picking at my nails while scrolling the mega.
Literally like my favorite part of presenting femme
I posted the Unjust Depths content warning in the lib queer discord & talked abt it a lil cause I havent seen it. I am reviewing early chapters for reference. The queer lib discord does not want me talking about murder queers which is deeply disappointing tbh, I would go off about Hunter III's eating habits in there all day. Stan a smol gay texan murder salamander! I have a lot of fun posting about stuff like that and weirding people out tbh.
Uh I legit forgot that the very first chapter is from Erich von Fueller's perspective... why? He is gonna disappear for like the vast majority of the next nine episodes, how long of a game are we setting up here?
::: spoiler Unjust Depths 9.4 except I got owned by GunslingerSky's superior free time and reading speed. How could this happen!!! The volume of Unjust Depths posting seems to be increasing dramatically though, which is rad.
Aaliyah is so fucking hardcore about Sieglinde, it's great. Ulyana is maybe understandably a lot more sympathetic to her, but Aaliyah is rightly all SHE KILLED OUR COMRADES IN THE REVOLUTION, SHE SHOULD BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE
I first saw the Restorative Justice concept discussed in The Last Girl Scout, and it's still really refreshing to me. Like IMO, if Aaliyah or Khajida just straight up slit her throat, it would be brutal and kind of pointless, indeed it wouldn't serve justice as Aaliyah says, but I'd find it kind of hard to blame them. But no, instead our hard-assed commie captain and commissar happily hear her out. So much for bloodthirsty tankies...
It's a great moment for Sieglinde too, it's hard not to be sympathetic to her. I mean she wasn't literally as child soldier but she was basically groomed for combat, under threat of not being accepted by her adopted family. She's also a little more based than I had expected, describing the leadership as "greedy Imperial landlords", lol.
Sieglinde needs a hug, big time...
Also CAPTAIN ULYANA IS ON HER WAY INTO UN-FUMBLE TOWN
It's so adorable & funny when Aaliyah folds her ears and her tail shakes a bit, like dawwwwww you fucking dorky cat! She has a soft center actually, and Ulyana absolutely must be getting close to repairing things.
KHAJIDA ❤ and then immediately KHAJIDA OH NO, now I feel bad for Sieglinde, rip. Not like it's unexpected though... :::
I love how these threads are growing bigger every week. Our posting is getting so powerful.
::: spoiler Spoiler-free Unjust Depths chicanery So I was thinkin really hard, mostly because every Diver pilot comes out of their machine covered in sweat and exhausted I suppose...
All of the enlisted soldiers onboard the Brigand must be incredibly fit, right? And maybe the sailors too? Like, DYEL-tier, muscular & athletic, surely. Idk how much mechanical resistance is or isn't involved in diver piloting, but like certainly right? In general? Just a secret cruiser full of incredibly strong women?
There's not a lot of descriptions of people's physicalities iirc, so Idk, maybe not. Sonya Shalikova is meant to be pretty slim, so maybe Diver piloting isn't that physically strenuous? But I'm kinda surprised that Depths hasn't leaned on "hot stronk women" thing at all, to my memory. Could always do it, y'knowwww...
Tbh the Buff Transbian is one of my favourite archetypes and rarely seen, so y'know! :::
::: spoiler Massive, nearly play-by-play analysis of Unjust Depths 9.5 - click for autistic transgender homosexuality!! 9.5: MAJIDA MENTIONED!!!!! Twice even! But this is The Relationships Chapter, for everybody.
Shalikova continues to be adorable in her nervous affection for Cuttlefish Lady. "Purple marshmallow"!!!!
It's a cool scene when she walks in to Maryam travelling in the aether, it really feels like her understanding of Maryam has increased considerably.
I love Sonya Shalikova so much. She could overtake Murati in my favourites. This scene is fucking adorable ugh I could keysmash about it. Nowt but love in my heart for them, the way Madiha writes their awkward new love makes me feel. Oh my god they're so cute help????? Like their bit is that Maryam is the overly enthusiastic sunshiney one and Shalikova is the overly serious stiff and awkward one, but they're so cute at eachother that the dynamic feels perfectly balanced between them.
Shalikova's narration of psionics also feels deeply textural in a way that says "the tism!" very loudly to me. Feels like more of a sensory thing for her, which is rad. Her stream of consciousness is full of flavour like that. I also like that Maryam observes that she feels "dominant and strong, like a Warlord", that's 'strong personality' right? My read is that Sonya's neurotype informs her entire experience of love and affection, and I adore that. There are dedicated romance novels with autistic leads that don't hit the mark as precisely as this.
HAHA, oh man de la Rosa talking about how she always strikes gold with freely available independent fiction, it might seem self-congratulatory if it weren't 100% true. I think I've said what she narrates about it 100% verbatim before.
de la Rosa feels like a self insert for my stupid ass, like Hello ma'am I am also hopelessly obsessed with gay women in my books. I am being reached out to by the author. I really like this, her little summary of Blind Princess and the Kind Retainer reads sort of like what I'm writing right now... There are multiple levels of meta at play, lol.
Lol, lmao! It's fun to see Handsome Gamer Genivov being nervous and awkward when she's usually so boisterous and loud. I like how when reading Unjust Depths, it pays not to judge a gay by their cover - characters will make weird or even bad impressions at first, and then unfurl amazingly, become fascinating and multi-faceted. Video games are reactionary and cringe, but it's nice to see de la Rosa tolerate Genivov's hobby :)
Handily contrasting how Shalikova sees psionics as an absolute win, meanwhile, Murati is all freaked out about the inequality of being able to read Karuniya's feelings when Karu cannot do the same. Dw Murati it's okay, Karu is a fucking weirdo so it all evens out. At this point "evil ingenuity" is rubbing me really wrongly coming from Karuniya, a fucking weirdo, should not be mischevious. "Hubby" is a straggot term, Karuniya, shut the fuck up.
For what it's worth, it is a decentish scene for the pair of them, and I don't intend to constantly belabour the fact of my boundless disdain for Karuniya. It is at least cool to see Murati show some sexual initiative, I realise now that one of the reasons their relationship can feel so creepy and unbalanced--especially in that 8.13 flashback--is that it's been Karuniya doing almost all of the horny perving, with Murati being mostly passive, which makes her feel weirdly objectified to me. This is at least a slight improvement to the status quo.
The way Zachikova and Arbitrator I are described as cuddling does not, as the narration says, seem out of character for me. It's a very casual, parallel-play type of physical affection, I know it and I like it. Autism. To be honest, Abritrator wrapping her body around Zachikova and sniffing at her hair while she's using a terminal, it reminds me of cuddling my wife sometimes. I adore that Zachikova feels comfortable enough around Madame Fishy, and that this level of comfort is new to her. Affection in general is new to Braya Zachikova, and she seems to have poor emotional regulation about it but isn't distressed by it, which is very cute.
...and then Zachikova says she's all-ready to kill Arbitrator I in a multitude of ways! Countermeasures because she's unfamiliar with cohabiting!! This is weird even to me, but it's funny and befitting of our favourite former spec-ops robotic lady. She is so blunt, they have a curious but deeply pleasant dynamic. This is the best fucking autism rep this side of The Outside by Ada Hoffmann, and the single best chapter of Unjust Depths thus far.
Relatedly, Arbitrator revealing herself to be a sexy(??) yet meek vampire fish is weirdly intimate. I feel weirdly sympathetic to Arbitrator's struggle not to harm humans despite her bloodlust, which is probably me and my murder-gays-affection speaking again. Arbitrator is all fucked up and borderline ashamed about it though, and I think extremely highly of Zachikova for calmly considering Arbitrator's problem without freaking out, she's so good to her fishy gf. I'm uh glad Zachikova can get off to it, there's so much going on in this one scene. Great stuff.
There are some scraps, too:
Ulyana in fact IS on her way to un-fumbling; she and Aaliyah are having more than one shot, in their night clothes, toasting to the proletarian revolution! Progress!! Mostly they talk about the progress of the Brigand's mission and its truly wonderful crew, but I liked Aaliyah drunkenly nuzzling Ulyana's hand, very cute.
ELENA IS READING THEORY NO FUCKING WAY, on her way to becoming a bonafide Mordecist!!! And telling Marina about it!!!!! It's great seeing Marina acknowledge that she hadn't been considering Elena's feelings, and Elena apologising for trying to hurt Marina. They'll get better together, as friends!
Euphrates and Tigris mostly bicker about current events and get a little inspired to resolve the Sunlight Foundation's internal contradictions, thanks to Murati. They are cute together at least, and it's nice to know Tigris took in Euphrates' blood to become immortal.
Haaaaaaaaaaha oh man, Sonya being so awkward asking Murati for advice is noooot stemming my nascent filthy rotten shipping instincts! They WILL kiss!!! Read eachothers', auras, homos, and play coy!!!! Avoid eachothers' clear affections
Is it kind of a pacing mishap to have ALL OF THESE relationship updates piled into one chapter? Maybe, but it's a good come-down after Goryk's Gorge, the ascent and all of the interrogations, plus it pulled my heartstrings a bunch of times. I was reading Into the Drowning Deep by Mira Grant (a messy but enjoyable shlock-horror novel) when I theorised: if you add queers, transes, autists, and other identities I have to your genre fiction's protagonists, it will greatly improve my investment in everything else, right up to action sequences. Unjust Depths is the absolute poster child for this though, the quality relationships are the bedrock for everything else, the political maneuvering and mecha action and deep-sea esoterics.
Addendum: In plot movement terms, at the end we finally get Carthus, once again, Erich's pet evil twink. My excitement knows no bounds, his dramatic expressions of being the mercury to Erich's sun, is this what yaoi is usually like? If you keep me on a steady dose of lesbians alongside it, I could get used to this too. Sing to your prince, racist pretty boy~!
I adore what an irredeemable little fuck Carthus is, ooh he's SUCH an evil murder twink. Nice to see that Erich has access to Sunlight's EDEN database too, and his bag is that the Sunlight Foundation basically allowed Emperor Nocht I to erase history and build this shitty empire with all its troubles. He wants to rewrite history and the empire in his own image. A united One World Government, beginning with the destruction of the summer palace. He is playing an EXCEEDINGLY long game. :::
Me waiting for the next trans mega
oh god i can feel myself becoming the basic ass trans girl with a praise kink in real time
::: spoiler Y'all tired of these Unjust Depths postings yet? 9.3 discussion. Not much to say about 9.3, kind of a slight chapter. I adore how Khajida feels equally:
Deeply disappointed/anticlimaxed that her rival, the Red Baron, is just a pathetic, sad, lacking, exhausted dumb bitch who sucks, and won't give her the satisfying victory of killing her
Gutted to see that Sieglinde is very much like her: middle aged and feeling the passage of time, slowing down, borderline sympathetic, and totally understandable
Hateful that Sieglinde is sad and self-pitying and feeling remorse after causing so much suffering and fighting for horrendous causes, killing her comrades
It's such a complicated tangle of emotions, it's kind of a huge mess after that lifelong rivarly. Hearing Khajida silently goad Sieglinde to do something about what a heartless, evil person she's been, it's great. But also though HOW DARE U KHAJIDA 42 YEARS IS NOT "OLD" >:|
The interrogations with Marina and Arbitrator are all absolutely hilarious though. When Ulyana asks why Marina wasn't honest about Elena being royalty, she yaps:
I was less pleased when Ulyana asked about uh, Elena's parentage. ULYANA!!! DO NOT FUCKING REFER TO HER AS A "FATHER"
I am so pleased that Aaliyah glares at her for this, good stuff. Beloved commissar.
Afterword we get Zachikova and Arbitrator I at the desk, and when Arbitrator describes the bomb collar Zachikova put on her as "a form of play", and declares her intent to breed with Zachikova, I lost it. Zachikova is furious and deeply flustered throughout the whole thing, so Arbitrator will call her "master" and Zachikova will threaten to blow her fucking head off, and then Aaliyah goes "This is an interrogation not some raunchy kink thread on a BBS!" I love her, ngl.
I am glad that Ulyana is asking the same what-are-her-motives questions I am about Arbitrator tho, and fwiw it does seem like Abritrator is just kinda vibing, like she probably actually just wants to kiss Zachikova a bunch? :::
::: spoiler i will never be tired of unjust depths discussion khadija's whole mess of feelings around sieglinde is so good. love her so much. any time 2 old rivals are in a scenario like that i cheer, and the ideological angle just makes it even better. the drama! sieglinde is so sad about everything and i'm sympathetic but also like "hey! you did very much kill a lot of people for an evil empire!" it rules
marina is so funny. ulyana shouldn't have made the comment but like, i'm not that unsympathetic to someone not thinking it through when talking about who provided sperm? it feels like one of those things where the language is complex and i'm not really gonna judge after she apologizes, you know? thank god for aaliyah tho, yeah
zachikova and arbitrator i are so funny!!! i love them so much, this whole scene rules. aaliyah just saying the quiet part out loud, it's really good. ulyana asking the correct questions, arbitrator is vibing and clearly has goals outside of kissing zachikova (and a history with the other omenseers) but that's the most important one, and enough to probably trust her
::: spoiler SUPERB, NOR SHALL I Top shelf indeed, I guess Sienglinde is like Gertrude if she weren't Garbage von Lichtenberg
So she's pathetic in a sympathetic way which makes it nail-biting and thrilling to watch them both be furious about eachothers' pasts until they kiss. Tbh by this point I wasn't expecting anybody over 40 to get paired off so uncritical support, I am overjoyed ✨
I don't hold it against Ulyana no, I did for a split second wonder if something beautiful had happened and Elena was the lovechild of Marina and Leda, that might have been kinda funny actually. It's a very slight mark against the "normalisation" argument for Karuniya I think, because certainly a society where trans people are completely normalised would have eradicated cisnormative language? But Ulyana is probably (maybe) (presumably?) (can we please have a 30+ hot trans lady somewhere on this boat, Ya Allah PLEASE) just a cis nerd and it's a great little moment for everyone's favourite covert intelligence cat
and her dorky captain.
Yes yes! To me Abritrator I seemed really sus when she showed up in the hangar and started being filthy, but I suppose it is simply a cultural difference between psionic fishy lesbians and monotone robot lesbians
I am glad we can more or less trust her, the folkloric aspect of the Omerseers' plot shenanigans is a superb new flavour for the series, and also tells us that in this setting everyone, even the eldritch sea creatures, has been gay for at least a millenium
:::
::: spoiler love to hear it yeah exactly! exactly! khadija is great, love that she's getting her enemies to lovers story in her middle age. she deserves it. and sieglinde deserves a chance to try and redeem herself, and also get her OWN enemies to lovers story! love these middle aged women getting a chance to shine!
hadn't elena already been born when marina first met leda? but what a beautiful thing to imagine, why not have hope? also in general idk what the correct way to refer to a trans woman as 'the one whose sperm led to the child' is, though obviously father is cisnormative and not correct. and ulyana and aaliyah are great, 100%
she can be gay and way too forward, as a treat. i do love all the omenseer lore, extremely fun
::: spoiler I have 0 social energy like 90 percent of the time but my stamina for discussing Unjust Depths is endless basically She is and yeah same, again the intergenerational vibes come through strong and wonderful. I desire to see her hang out with the young'uns due to this, every time she says about "the new generation of warriors meant to take her place" and shit. We love to see it!!!
Yes I think she had but counterpoint: I forgor :) the idea that Konstantin was fuming and buttmad because he got cucked by a transbian covert agent is so fucking rad, y'know? Would also explain why Erich seems to disdain Elana, uh okay new headcanon!
I'm not sure either, I was kinda hoping Unjust Depths would tell me :)
Omenseers deserve little treats!!! I like how there is one aphotic sea horror per plot-relevant ship currently, this is going really well & the Brigand's crew just expanded in very fascinating ways. :::
::: spoiler hell yeah me too yeah! i wanna see more scenes like the one where she mentored shalikova! lots of potential, she's not in my top 5 characters but is one i always love to see more of
hmmm yeah. i agree, it's much more fun to imagine this and marina just not believing it to be true. and yeah idk. if the union hasn't figured it out i really have no idea what one might blurt out when theorizing there
yeah it's fun! the brigand keeps taking on new passengers it didn't really mean to, but it's great to see. i hope they end up needing to somehow build more rooms to house all the people they pick up
::: spoiler Love to see it!! I think broadly as well, I just wanna see more inter-crew interaction on the Brigand, such a fascinating collection of gays to chat!!! Aw don't make me choose a top 5 characters though, I will not choose a favourite child
Yep you cannot remove my headcanon, Marina is just a chad and can't handle it
beloved. There has to be an answer to this but Idk either yaw.
SHIP MAINTENANCE AND EXPANSION, BRIGAND GETS A NEW DECK
The blueprint originally had a third floor, so it's actually plausible that they could add a Dedicated Gay Housing level.
:::
::: spoiler you do indeed love to see it absolutely! wanna see more interpersonal interactions forever, but it's probably for the best the plot keeps moving. i wasn't gonna, but since you brought it up who are your top 5? don't need to be in order
misread as Dedicated Guy Housing and was like "well i would describe some of these characters as funny little guys (maryam mostly, but i could be convinced of arabella) but i don't think any of them are guys" :::
::: spoiler Head Full, Many Thought: Unjust Depths 9.1-9.2 Sonya Shalikova kissed her cuttlefish lady finally, and it was adorable. I relate strongly to her acting alienated about the ways people date and have sex, very cool. She could do it for Maryam!!!!
Conversely Dear Zachikova, the fish lady with the gore robe emerging from a pile of fleshy briney guts is NOT AT ALL SUS, she is NOT MIND CONTROLLING YOU and you should DEFINITELY FUCK HER lmao. I do like how blunt Zachikova's narration is about her attractions and lack thereof. She is extremely, deeply unconcerned about fucking the newly-formed fish lady. Took a lot of restraint not to fuck her on the floor of the hangar though, I never had Zachikova pegged for "too horny to live, will be subsumed by a sexy sea creature"... uncritical support though, lol. I like Arbitrator I and her aid in the ascent of the Brigand is extremely cool, the whole Omenseers thing fucks really hard.
During that same ascent, Yana finally gets over her hangups with EMOTIONAL SUPPORT CATGIRL AALIYAH, WHO GETS YOU THROUGH SUDDEN ASCENT! Everything from the point Ulyana realises that Arbitrator I is the dancer fish to the point where she calls for damage assessment is rad.
Meanwhile onboard the Antenora, I really did expect Norn to just beat the absolute living shit out of Gertrude, repeatedly, viciously. I woulda critically supported her, even! But the way she sees Emperor Konstantin in Gertrude, how she feels like a failure of a mentor, how she grants forgiveness to her, and the way she considers all of this as she stares at her own clenched fist while time is stopped? Again it's a stellar moment for her. Norn always seems like she's just rampaging around manipulating and murdering motherfuckers to take her bottomless anger out, but there's so much going on with her internally. Her complicated feelings about the Emperor, her shrouded mysterious past with the Sunlight Foundation, her bond with Adelheid. She is an absolutely fucking superb villian. If evil lady bad, why sympathetic and complex and fascinating??? I cannot fathom her motivations and I desperately want to know.
Out of the Loser Gang, Selene sees the most immediate change, having been schooled by some funny gay autist.
And as a result Sonya has a rival now, finally!! Selene deserves to feel like a pathetic untermensch or whatever the fuck, what a nerd lol. What credibility did she have?
But aside from ubermensch here getting dunked on, I learned a lot about her inner workings. When Selene asks questions about Who She Is, Why She Was Born, What She Is Meant For, I realise finally that she has fundamentally misunderstood the concept of purpose in life.
She asserts that natal humans are born with innate destinies, in families, states, ethnicities and such. She asserts that even Katarrans have a born purpose, but that she has nothing as a blank-slate person, and asks how to attain a destiny if not born with it. She is so myopically focused on PURPOSE that she cannot envision making her own. A character flaw of sorts. She desperately wants to be told her purpose, and knows not what she would do with herself if given freedom. Norn, who lives in spite of her grand stated purposes, strikes a fascinating contrast.
I'll be real, chat, Unjust Depths is really picking up. Its leads are gaining in complexity and the pacing is tighter than a guitar string. Already good and only keeps getting better. :::
::: spoiler hell yeah shalikova is getting her girl! love them so much. arbitrator i is like the opposite of sus, would you not immediately trust a beautiful girl who popped out of the flesh of a monster you pulled in from the sea? i love zachikova's weird relationship with her, it's very funny. and yeah! ulyana is making progress!
this is such a good moment for norn. like, yeah! she's about to beat the shit out of gertrude, but i think what she actually does might have hurt gertrude worse. gertrude is SO pathetic, it's astounding. there's a really fantastic piece of art of gertrude at this point in the story and she looks wretched. just completely broken. if i can find it i'll show you
and yeah, selene is really kinda fascinating. just a completely alien way of viewing the world to me, but it's also really sad. she's a little weirdo and i'm kinda rooting for her? not like, to win in fights, but to figure out her place in the world. and yeah she makes a good rival! :::
::: spoiler HELL YEAH Much love for the various bits of relationship progress this chapter. Also uh Idk, uncritical support but given that she's from the same line of Omenseers as the one that's currently piloting the world-ending Dagon fleshboat, uh I dunno yaknow =) "I arose from the primordial sea, I have psionic ability beyond your ken, have sex with me funny robot lady!" I do like that Zachikova is sort of getting 'awakened' in relationship terms by her, and I do like fish lady, but I don't really trust her motives. I'm with Yana on this one, a positive force for now but highly suspect...
It's incredible, and the mental breakdown Gertrude has in the brig afterword is even sadder. "Hours must have turned into days into weeks", but nah 14 hours, you are just weak willed, inquisitor. She has reached roughly the right conclusion through completely wrong means: Yes, your career was built on blood and guts just to get gf. Yes, you have no commitment and no ideology without gf. Yes, it is roughly the edifice of Empire and its stratified social castes which kept you from gf. So now she is going to murder every ruler in the empire, which lol. At least her uncomprehending fury is pointing in vaguely the right direction? But she IS wretched. I do not approve of her using a rebound-puppy! Ingrid is equally as pathetic but I feel really bad for her!!!
I dunno what it would take for Selene to quit being weird and sad, her worldview is so broken and warped. Theoretically Norn is one of the healthier people she could have as a mentor, but her brainworms are extremely terminal Idk. I still don't understand why she desires to be ORDAINED A DESTINY BY DIVINE RIGHT or whatever, it almost feels like I'm missing context for her that I should have... :::
::: spoiler all the relationship stuff is great! yeah lmao. arabella is not exactly putting the most trustworthy foot forward! but i still love everything with her and zachikova, even if it's definitely wise to keep an eye on her. on the other hand if zachikova is enjoying herself who are we to judge!
absolutely. gertrude is maybe the biggest failgirl in the story. hopefully she kills a lot of rulers though, that'd be fun! and yeah she's so awful to ingrid, you can't play with her feelings like that! also i found the fanart! look at this wretched creature
yeah idk what it would take, probably being captured by the brigand? but that seems unlikely at this stage
also i started rereading 9 to double check when shit happened and make sure i wasn't referencing future things and i got sucked in and am halfway through the second intermission now
::: spoiler All submarines should have this much lesbianism!! It's not that I think she's evil or whatever, like Hunter III is good people, Omenseers can be good people. I guess she's only really A) saved the Brigand from agarthic death B) tried to... uh it's the overly-enthusiastic sexual advances that give me pause, I guess. Zachikova seems sort of mixed, like she clearly wants to know more before they bang in public, and yes me too!! I am curious to see them talk, & stuff. I also assume Arabella has a bigger motive for getting onboard the Brigand than just loving Zachikova, like she's at war with other Omenseers or something, but I could be wrong?
Tbh, if she just turns her rage around and crashes the Iron Lady into the Fueller castle, or obliterates the Volkische or whatever, that's the best action for her now. Ingrid deserves better :( Also lol nice, yeah that's about correct. #1 failgirl ✨
Idk if that would even help, like Selene is so actually deranged it's not funny. Wants to be needed by Norn...
Yeeeeeah :D it's engrossing, I read it in huge chunks whenever I'm goofing off at work. :::
::: spoiler joining a submarine crew and getting mad it isn't like unjust depths and i don't get a meet-cute with a lesbian disguised as a nun oh yeah i absolutely get you. zachikova is definitely at least a little too confused to be completely on board at this stage. we do get into her more very soon!
yeah that'd be ideal probably. though not ideal for ME because i want to see the drama when her and elena run into each other again! i want gertrude to feel even worse and elena to try and fix her!
yeah... i feel bad tho... i wanna see her happy!
yeah i read the whole 2nd intermission (really good! super interesting stuff that's kinda similar to the first one but also i like it way more) and have started episode 10 lmao. it's really engrossing, that's definitely the right word. i have been reading it while i should be doing other things
::: spoiler It would be killer recruitment material for a navy, you cannot deny... Looking forward to getting into spooky fish lady more very soon!!!
Okay c'mon you are brutal, you wouldn't really wish that upon our freshly communised princess would you? Elena so does not deserve to be saddled with the task of trying to fix Actual Human Trainwreck Gertrude. It might be funny, it might also be very sad, hmmmm...
I do not have enough investment in Selene personally to want to see her happy, Idrk who she even is or where she came from. Did I skip a chapter?
Nice, pacing aside I liked Intermission 1, I'm hoping the squeakwuel gives us updates on characters who have long since vacated the plot: Yangtze, Victoria Van Veka, Sawyer, the anarchists and the Khaybar Pass shimii, Erich. I desire to see them again!!! :::
::: spoiler if i could join the union navy i would well i would feel very bad for her but i think she would like to try and have that closure and also still loves gertrude despite everything. and also it would be very juicy and sad. oh shit a new piece of unjust depths fanart relevant to this just dropped today (gertrude and elena)
she's just part of norn's crew, i don't think you missed anything. idk i'm a sucker for this kind of sad girl who sucks like that
::: spoiler incredibly vague intermission 2 structure spoilers it's more structured than the first in a way i like, but there's still a bunch of that broader scope world stuff, as well as some new bits that are very fun :::
is almost as trans as bridget's theme
tekken 8 looks kind of busted, sajam seems to be getting shitty connections and 1 and done matchups all the time. shoutout to alpacas tho
::: spoiler Relitigating my stupid takes on Unjust Depths 13.8 that suck We should all benefit from my extensive pain & suffering today, because despite everything I did manage to improve my understanding somewhat. Consider this a follow up to my welcome to hell, 8.13) post.
First off, my assumption about Karuniya's "thing" being neurotypical woo-woo was absolutely completely accurate. This I simply know to be the case, because if you ask neurotypicals (or even anybody neurodiverse, usually) about this type of thing, they'll just wave their fingers mysteriously and be confused about why you do not 'get' & adore it. They'll act like it is simply known, so no luck there. Makes sense, I think the entire flashback is really underwritten; long passages of dialogue go unaccompanied by any real descriptive narration or anything beyond Karuniya's running commentary. I don't think it gives the reader a sense of the affection between them, which as an autist makes perfect sense, 'pls be more obvious' y'know.
The revelation that I hadn't considered, because it does not enter my mind, because wtf, is something most readers probably find really obvious: ✨ It's a butch/femme bit ✨ ! And I was like ohhhhhhh, a lightbulb powered on in my brain, this makes perfect sense! Karuniya isn't a creep because she's necessarily a weird fetishist, she's a creep because the bit they're doing is a literal husband-and-wife bit!!! Although you do have to wonder, on their first date, has Murati agreed to play The Man in this relationship? Was it discussed, does it count as consenting if they woo-woo vibes make eyes at eachother neurotypically? It sort of seems like Karuniya has constructed a "Murati" in her brain before they even date.
Vibes-based analysis, I see two sorts of contexts, ish, in which butch/femme appears as a 'thing'. One is mostly as an aesthetic or stylistic choice for the people involved, and not a lot more than that? The other one I tend to associate with like, old 1970s bar culture, and has both of them be almost gender identities unto themselves, with the butch basically being a 1:1 comedy trad man replacement. A thing! (Please bully me over this weird and probably wrong read, I do not pride myself on social understanding)
It's pretty efficient as an explanation, because whenever I've read queer fic that plays into this really specific gendery butch/femme, I have been almost as weirded out by those too. Personally I never got why you'd want to replicate stock-standard heterosexual RETVRN gender roles with women... but I tend not to worry about it. If cis women wanna do that, sure, power to you. Hell, if trans people wanna, of course, who the fuck am I to say no?
The problem I have with 8.13 is many compounding things: as I nudged above, it kind of seems like this whole idea only comes from Karuniya's end, like it's wholly her thing and she pushes it onto Murati. In the flashback I feel like I can read Murati's reaction to it as anything from "slightly bemused" to "really awkward", and she seems more confused than anything when Karuniya starts calling her "husband" way back. Recently, as in circa 9.x, Karuniya has taken to calling her "hubby" and does Murati ever respond to it??? The time when Murati observes that Karuniya is "a screamer" in 9.5 is literally the first time I can remember that Murati has expressed, really romantic or sexual attraction, not just to her fiance but to ANYBODY. She's so passive and quiet about it, even in her inner thoughts, and Karuniya's enthusiastic prattling seems weird by contrast. I had kind of hoped 8.13 was gonna show us that Yes, Murati wants it too! but only barely. The romantically inexpressive, surprisingly unreactive Murati is a poor match for Karuniya's over-enthused neurotypical hypersexuality.
The truth is though, it doesn't really cover for Karuniya being desperately cock-hungry all the time. I don't need to belabour that point though, because frankly pretty much everything I said in that post still holds up. Karuniya seems flippant and uninterested in anything about Murati that doesn't involve sex. Do they ever talk about anything else? Surely Karuniya should be asking Murati how her squad leadership is going, right, since it's new for her? I know so much more about the link between Sonya and Maryam, or Norn and Adelheid, than I do the protagonist and her fiance.
I think Murati/Karuniya is an underwritten mess, lacking a lot of the small, telling details you would usually see in a good romance, or even several of the relationships in Unjust Depths!! It's an ugly mix and I hate it, I really wish I could not think this, but there is soooooo much at play here.
As an addendum: I find it interesting that Murati/Karuniya as a pair is so steeped in a real-world parsing of gender between sapphics. Most of the relationships in UD range anywhere from "somewhat removed from our social context" (autistic mech pilot x psionic cuttlefish churchlady) to "waaaay removed from our social context", (autistic robot lady x bloodsucking shifter fish woman from the depths) I do really like that the author is so enamoured with fish, it's cute and fun. But I'm not primed to expect what is bssically a sapphic romance trope, to me it sticks out like a sore thumb. :::